NSW Police to get hacking powers

The New South Wales Government has unveiled plans to give state police the power to hack into computers remotely, with owners potentially remaining in the dark about the searches for up to three years.

We have been fine-tuning this legislation to ensure that we can keep up with fast evolving technology

NSW Premier Nathan Rees

The new powers are part of a package introduced into parliament last week by Premier Nathan Rees. Broadly, they aim to give police the right to apply for covert search warrants from the Supreme Court to gather evidence in cases which could involve serious indictable offences punishable by at least seven years' imprisonment.

Judges issuing the new warrants could authorise owners not being told about the searches for up to three years (under exceptional circumstances), NSW Police Minister Tony Kelly said in a statement, with police having to apply for several extensions to get the full period.

Rees said the laws would enable computers to be searched, including access to "computers networked to a computer at the premises being searched".

"Police will also be able to gain remote access to computers for seven days at a time, up to a total of 28 days or longer in exceptional circumstances, to allow them, to undertake forensic off-site examiniation," Rees said.

"This could including cracking codes and searching computers for evidence of child porn, drug running and money laundering."

Offences covered by the new laws include the supply, manufacture or cultivation of drugs, possesson, manufacture or sale of firearms, money laundering, car or boat re-birthing and unauthorised access to modification of computer data or electronic communications.

Also included are theft (if carried out on an organised basis), violence causing grievous bodily harm or wounding, possession, manufacture or supply of false instruments, corruption, destruction of property, homicide and kidnapping.

"We have been fine-tuning this legislation to ensure that we can keep up with fast evolving technology," said Rees. "This places police on an equal footing with the criminals they are tracking."

The news comes after similar moves in Europe have recently been gathering pace. For example, in January the UK government said it had agreed to work with the European Union parliament on plans to extend police powers to conduct remote searches of computers.

However, not everyone has been happy with the initiatives, with privacy campaigners complaining and security vendors maintaining they would protect users' computers indiscriminately, regardless of who was attempting to break in to them.

The covert search warrants would be available to the NSW Police Force, the NSW Crime Commission and the Police Integrity Commission.

Talkback 30 comments

    The Police State is here Anonymous -- 09/03/09

    I guess it's farewell to our rights.

    Why are these totalitarian (Stasi-style) powers required? Where are the safeguards to avoid abuse?

    Police can already confiscate your car whenever the hell they feel like it, they'll just claim you were racing (too bad if your tyres screeched because of loose road surface, oil or sand on the road), and you've got no appeal.

    It's clear the NSW Labor govt have to go. Just like the UK Labour govt they've been in too long and are giving the police whatever they ask for, not thinking about the intrusion into innocent people's lives.

    Citing the UK as a precedent is for the ignorant in the audience, right? Look at the recent history of UK govt violating the Data Protection Act and being found guilty of violating European human rights laws. (No wonder some people refer to Gordon Brown as Stalin.)
    Just because the UK govt is asking the EU to let it do something doesn't mean it will happen.

    How can someone contest a secret warrant that has been requested because of a falsified affidavit? This is ridiculous.

    It's like the terrorism hotline - another opportunity to have the cops harrass the neighbour who's dog took a dump on your lawn, just with some anonymous lies.

    'including access to "computers networked to a computer at the premises being searched"' - so one warrant will allow searching every computer on the entire Internet now?

    It's not surprising that surveillance laws may need updating, and I'd support reasonable measures, but this goes too far.

    I was hoping we were finally starting to get past the totalitarian security "because I'm scared" nonsense that started with the 2001 terrorist attacks.

    The world can never be perfect, so let's try and find a sensible balance please.

    Don't destroy our free society.

    Some crims will always get away, it's better that some do instead of innocent people being monitored by a police state. If you disagree, look at the history of repressive regimes you're advocating for, Nazi Germany, USSR, East Germany, Communist China, etc.

    It's sad where Australia is coming to.

    Protection davo -- 10/03/09 (in reply to #320125227)

    We need the protection that this will provide. Privacy died with terrorism and the new world order. You voted for this when they were throwing kids overboard and invaded Iraq. If you are against this then you must be pro terrorism and pro organised crime. The horse bolted years ago with your blessings, dont whinge about it now.

    Protection ? Anonymous -- 10/03/09 (in reply to #320125250)

    davo - You have no idea what your talking about your abviously just another sheep that listens to all the ridiculous hype that govt advertising push's at whatever target group they want to get onside, so they can have outragous powers.
    This push for more and more police powers is being done in the same way hitler eventually got everyone to burn books, start saying one thing is bad, get them onside, say something else is bad .. etc .. etc, soon youve got everyone doing pretty much exactly what you tell them to do, because they have no rights not to do it.

    The Police State Anonymous -- 10/03/09 (in reply to #320125250)

    Don't tell me who I voted for. I never voted for Howard (or his candidates) because I remembered he was a two-faced racist little **** who left a wrecked economy when he was treasurer.

    There was no way in hell I was going to vote for him when he was making those thinly-veiled racists statements about who should come into the country.

    I was against invading Iraq, but for going into Afghanistan (where the terrorists were actually based).

    Why is it when you say "new world order" I'm reminded of the "Thousand year Reich!"

    You're obviously an idiot like GW Bush ('either you're with us or with the terrorists') - you're talking bullshit.

    I'll continue to be against this oppression. Balance and sense must be restored, and just because there's been backwards steps is no reason to give up, it's more reason to argue for the situation to be corrected (eventually the USA did release Japanese Americans which were all put in prison camps during WW2, and the communism witchhunt by Sen. McCarthy did end).

    ZDNet censorship sucks Anonymous -- 10/03/09 (in reply to #320125289)

    Nice, your ***** makes it look like I said something worse than I did. I was using the term referring to unmarried parents, nothing more.

    Nice how the cow dung term was not censored! WTF ZDNet?

    Yeah right Anonymous -- 16/03/09 (in reply to #320125289)

    Shame it's your buddy Kev that's the one introducing net filtering as well, or do you convienently forget that?

    Yes I feel much more comfortable with Wayne Swann as treasurer....

    Terrorism Anonymous -- 05/11/09 (in reply to #320125250)

    Terrorism is the poor mans war, and war is the rich mans terrorism! I suggest that davo get an education outside of america so that he can see the truth in what is happening around the world. In 1776 americans were the terrorists according to england. Many of the terrorist acts around the globe are committed by British agents, american agents, and Israeli agents! They have been caught many times in the acts, and have even admitted to some! There are many documents to show this, but you need to think for yourself and do some home work for a change! Open your eyes! You will be shocked at what you can see!

    So who will they use ? Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    And who will the police use to do this? You guessed it - their tame hacker criminals.
    yes the same ones who the police will haul out of jail or serving court orders preventing them from going near computer systems.
    Pah - yes we all believe the police are not corrupt. I think this needs to go before the human rights comission and Australian Federal court.

    Criminals dressed up in lovely blue uniforms.
    And stupid politicians so far removed from reality its beyond a joke.

    Of course Nathan -- 10/03/09 (in reply to #320125230)

    The reality is every single politician who tries to implement legislation and policy that relates to information technology always gets it completely wrong. They are almost always from the generation that haven't grown up with computers. Most would only know how to turn a computer on, let alone understanding IT matters such as hacking and filtering.

    What we need is IT professionals entering in to politics and filling IT portfolios. It will put an end to all these ridiculous legislation and policy measures implemented by people who ask us tech geeks to fix there computers and remove viruses that their 'browsing habits' have infected their system.

    There Is An Answer! Rex Alfie Lee -- 13/03/09 (in reply to #320125246)

    Jump off the Windows brigade & join the Linux force. With a decent password & a little double encryption using a decent key, no-one's going to get into your data anyway. Once you have a password of 18 characters that don't belong to 2 words or 1, then the possibilities of the best computer breaking your code is about 50000 years, or more. I doubt the NSW cops have that sort of processing power anyway.

    Commedic, Plain Commedic Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    nswpolicemonitor.exe - Kill Process

    The above is what can be expected when you see govenment orginization and IT in the same sentance. They simply have no clue and dont want to listen to peopel that do.

    Good Luck, nup nups.

    Too true Anonymous -- 13/03/09 (in reply to #320125254)

    Funny/sad but true. You hit the nail on the head.

    hack-prone Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    Another reason not to use Windows.

    How they'll do it Mystikan -- 10/03/09

    The police have the same problem cybercrooks do: in order to get into someone's computer, they need to set up a backdoor, or Trojan, on the target machine. These are usually injected by two main means: 1) Social engineering through phishing (emails, forum posts etc) and 2) drive-by downloads injected via Javascript. We already know not to trust emails that tell us things like "Your bank account has been deactivated, please click here to reactivate it", we know not to visit certain websites, and the mosre savvy amongst us are using Firefox + NoScript (or a similar setup) to protect against Javascript drive-bys.

    So now we simply regard Government emails and websites in the same way we regard other phishing emails and websites. Treat emails originating from government departments as spam - no government department has any reason to require you to install anything or visit any website. (I don't even install the Tax Pack software - I do my tax the old-fashioned way, on a written form). Further, treat government websites the same way you'd treat a crack-and-keygen or porn website - Javascript does not run, cookies are not set.

    Finally, there's always the old "wait till he's gone out then sneak into his house and plant the bug" trick. Easily solved, by the same trick I use to prevent data theft in the event of theft of my computer: all hard drives in my system are either external or mounted in quick-release removable drive bays. When I go out, so do the hard drives. Then the thief can steal the computer (which is easily replaced) - or the cops can pop in their Trojans or whatever - and when you come back, you replace the hard drives and away you go. If you're really paranoid, you can rip the case off and check for unfamiliar hardware when you come back.

    So with a good firewall, up-to-date antivirus (at least the security vendors are on our side!), some good anti-scripting browser plugins, removable hard drives and a modicum of common sense you need not worry about the police getting into your computer any more than any other hacker.

    "the power to hack into computers remotely" Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    so .... hack my computer remotely hah? now what happends if i log their attempts and sue? or decide to "probe" the offending IP with say a few OC3 connections for the pure sake of it? What happens if i setup a honeypot for our boys in blue and systematically waste hundreds of hours of their time? will i get charged and go to jail?

    Oh please! Police and hacking computers remotely is like saying McDonalds is a fine cuisine restaurant

    Power and the glory Mel Sommersberg -- 10/03/09 (in reply to #320125271)

    "hack my computer remotely hah? now what happends if i log their attempts and sue?"

    If they are going by the book you can't sue them.

    "or decide to "probe" the offending IP with say a few OC3 connections for the pure sake of it?"

    You can't. It's illegal.

    "What happens if i setup a honeypot for our boys in blue and systematically waste hundreds of hours of their time? will i get charged and go to jail?"

    Probably, if they can establish that you did it deliberately to cover your backside.

    "Oh please! Police and hacking computers remotely is like saying McDonalds is a fine cuisine restaurant"

    If you are worried about an understaffed/overworked police force haxoring your lil ol' computer then you must be doing something wrong. :-p Chances are that these new powers will only be granted to those with big fish to fry.

    On the subject of the national sec hotline Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    they say on the TV ad's "you can remain anonymous" yeah right, the technology to trace calls in about 10 seconds is now in use. has been for about 4 years, it's also like when you call 131444 (police communications) the number is traced, logged, and let one word slip that's out of order and wham mr five o will be knocking on your door!

    also most users out there utilise Personal internet security packages behind their ADSL router's which do provide a degree of security by the nature of NAT, what i'm saying is, as far as i am aware the only country that has agreement's in place with security vendor's is the USA, i would seriously like to see a person properly hack through 3 levels of network security, without being detected by firewalls for suspicious network activity, and then to hack a user's password and then potentially have to hack and crack an encrypted file system. good luck to the NSW police, you are not the NSA, MI6/MI5, or any true high tech outfit. Users will notice a performance degradation and will investigate or call in an IT specialist who will take one look and then say ha that's interesting the ip address tracks back to the NSW police

    Personal Internet Security Packages Rex Alfie Lee -- 13/03/09 (in reply to #320125274)

    Those that know do, those that don't don't. The truth is that of the over 45's most have little understanding of what you have just written. These also comprise a large minority of computer owners. Computers for the over 45s generally belonged in IT departments until later on they appeared in workplace & they needed retraining. Not only is the vast majority of these owners illiterate when it comes to what software actually does they are also at a loss as to what a computer virus, trojan, worm or spyware is. They also couldn't care less.

    I'm one the over 45s & have worked alongside them for those number of years in both a IT technician capacity & also other capacities. I still am asked to do the most basic things. The idea of someone realising the need to backup their data, from possibly Windows 98 or perhaps XP, let alone pay for all the protection you are talking about is beyond their understanding.

    You may be right about the ability to check the IP address which I'd dare say will be a bogus proxy spoofed over the original. Finding that won't be easy as you come across various knowledgeable levels that are going to tell you zip.

    Meanwhile change over to Linux & encrypt your stuff if you that way inclined. Then they'll get nothing but they'll probaby come in & take your drive away & check it under legal means anyway.

    Another Week Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    Another week, another announcement of increased police powers in NSW. I am waiting for the day that they finally have enough powers to get the buses going past my home to travel at the speed limit or perhaps enforce the keep left laws on multilane roads. No statement from the worthless squatters on the other side of the house that they would do anything different.

    Perspective? Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    "Broadly, they aim to give police the right to apply for covert search warrants from the Supreme Court to gather evidence in cases which could involve serious indictable offences punishable by at least seven years' imprisonment."

    A few points:
    1. Still requires a judge to grant it, and must involve serious indictable offences punishable by at least seven years' imprisonment.
    2. How is it different to a three year phone tap? Do police tell you before they tap your phone?

    You can protect yourself, as others are saying.

    Based solely on the information in the article I don't see the problem. If I was committing a "serious indictable offences punishable by at least seven years' imprisonment" then I'd be worried, because not only can they now a. search my house and b. listen to my telephone calls, they can c. find my Evil Mastermind plans that I've sent via email to my Evil Henchmen.

    Again, based solely on the information in the article I don't see much difference to the powers police already have. They are just catching up to the technology criminals (and eyeryone else) are using. I don't see this as a threat to liberty and personal freedom, so long as it needs a judge to grant the warrant, and the conditions stipulated are met.

    Communism Here We Come Anonymous -- 10/03/09

    "Judges issuing the new warrants could authorise owners not being told about the searches for up to three years"

    Under the current law, how does one go about being told whether their computer has been searched by Police? Do the Police have to tell you after a certain period after theyve searched your computer? is this period currently a few days, weeks, months or a year?

    where are the state and national boundires ? Anonymous -- 11/03/09

    What about "computers networked to a computer at the premises being searched". Again what is a "premise"? how can they stop at an invisible VPN link that has threads to points all over the world?
    How are the police to know where to stop, an IP can be anywhere in the world ?
    One Suspect PC in a university and they have the right to search 4500+ PCs?

    Good luck C#ntsable! wolfie -- 12/03/09

    Yeah go ahead - hack my computer Mr NSW Policeman :) A few basic security precautions and it just 'aint gonna happen. NAT device / external FW, host FW, anti-malware, HD encryption etc etc...

    The only guaranteed way in is via physical access to a machine, for which a warrant would be required.

    Anyone doing anything dodgy will take a few basic precautions if they have half a brain.

    This "hack in and remotely access" idea is fantasy...

    So can they hack the entrie 'net legally? Anonymous -- 12/03/09

    Does this:
    "Rees said the laws would enable computers to be searched, including access to "computers networked to a computer at the premises being searched".

    Mean that every computer connected to say, oh, um the Internet or at least that part of it in NSW or maybe even Aust is OK to hack into, or just the upstream ISP router?
    If you allow access to non directly connected computers it will be the whole net, poentenetially.
    How will PC plod identify that he has crossed a border, national or international, you can't definitively trust IP addresses or domains to give you location in all cases.

    And the what liability will the police incur if someone else discovers their backdoor?
    What if they damage files, will they be liable, assuming you can identify it was them that did it?
    What if you take massive losses because they police hacking tools don't work as they expected?
    What if some of the above happens and gosh, you turn out innocent?

    What is wrong with using the current search laws?

    Re Davo, I think that perhaps some of you are interpreting his words a little literally.

    As an ex gun owner all I can do is say we told you so.

    Ex-gun Owner Rex Alfie Lee -- 13/03/09 (in reply to #320125514)

    Some of what you say is true ex-gunnie. I agree to some of it completely except that as an ex-gun owner ... You **** Look at the USA & how many people are being killed over there every day bcoz of gun ownership. Thank the ether we got rid of those laws. If they'd been canned twenty years before many others would still be alive. Martin Bryant, sweet boy that he is, wouldn't have ever had the balls to have done what he did if he'd not had a gun. The beauty of it for Martin was his ability to do it at a distance not up close & personal. The guy is a coward; I know because I've dealt with him in prison.

    The rest of what you say is completely apt but you're way off mark with your trigger-happy response.

    Re anonymous and the US agreements Anonymous -- 12/03/09

    Sorry I didnt not notice those comments but I feel I gotta bite.

    The US may have agreements in place with secuurity vendors, but some countries, i.e. UK< Australia, NZ and Canada have extrordinarily close ties with US on intel matters.
    I am not saying it has happened or will, but then again I would not be the least surprised if the US had not given the signatories of various sigint agreements access to any backdoors they may have.

    Try looking up AUSCANZUKUS or the UK-USA agreements on sigint - which I suspect computer hacking would be for the purpose of of treaties and agreements.
    And if not I would nto be surprised to find the US doing in on behalf of Aust, UsAust doig it on behalf of the US etc etc to get around laws such as the law where the NSA is not supposed to spy on US citizens in the US.
    Easy just give the UK or the Aussies the backdoor and they can spy on US citizens in the US and share the info under the agreement.

    Again I am not saying this is happening or has happened but it would not surprise me if it did or at least if the countries shared backdoors.
    Though theoretically that should not help the police. Except of course the police talk with ASIS, ASIO and DSD, especially special branch. ANd if your of foreign extraction your criminal profits might be succouring terrorism...

    In any case even without actually being given the backdoors, lots of white. grey and blackhats crack systems all the time, many of them doing it as a hobby, do you really think that the federal govt or even a state gov or maybe some state govs pooling resources can't do it too?

    Me thinks you think NAT provides you with altogether more insurance that it really does.

    Linux, Baby, Linux Rex Alfie Lee -- 13/03/09 (in reply to #320125515)

    There are no trapdoors, backdoors, US Gov't sanctioned permits for using Linux. A better graphic user experience & the Gov't can't enter your box without physically doing it anyway.

    Don't need as many malware protections either & it will cost you less for the same amount of software. Use your Windows for games if you must but use the Linux box for all else.

    A backdoor on every PC? TerraHertz -- 14/03/09

    One must presume that if they have got this far with the legislation, they have some idea HOW they would implement such remote searches of any PC they wish.

    I wonder what 'backdoor' they might be thinking of using? It must be something that will work for Windows, Linux and Macs. Something virtually universal. Something with permissions for almost all firewalls. Now what software package has both a high level of access to the TCP/IP stack, and such universality and permissions? Also, is produced by one of the 'pro-government, pro DRM, pro NWO evil companies. A package that *everyone* uses, many times a day? How about....

    Flash

    Originally by Macromedia (bastards), now distributed by Adobe - who are even worse.

    Try removing Flash from your PC, and see how much web content and adverts just stops working. It's so unbiquitous now. A backdoor in the Flash player would suit the government needs perfectly. The Flash player will typically be fetching streams of 'stuff' from all over, with control backchannels too. Who's going to notice some extra Kbytes woven into the flow?

    Oh, and Flash would also provide a perfect vector for some kind of i-911 'hacker attack', if TPTB ever decided the net simply had to be turned off, once and for all.

    Human Rights? What Human Rights? Wrongly accused -- 23/03/09

    One wonders where the line is crossed. I wonder just what the police will do with my computer files, which contain serious complaints of corruption and communication with my solicitor which is legal privilage.

    The Federal Keystone Kops tried to convict me on child porn charges after some @SSH@LE tapped into my wireless router and downloaded all of this stuff. I had a couple of adult video clips that were of legitimate porn stars on my computer, and guess what, they tried to convict me on that. Now can everyone see the danger.

    I urge everyone to email, write or what ever your local member, as well as your opposition and the premier on this issue and voice your disgust.

    The police already have unprecedented power, I know I was the victim of that after being assaulted in my own home and maliciously prosecuted by a team of moral absolutists. Fortunately, the case was thrown out after just 30 minutes of court time, but what about the HUGE amount of PUBLIC money used in this case.

    YES, they need to catch these people, but they already have the means to do that, as well as the means to maliciously pursue you.

    They already violate Human Rights in Australia..... OPPS we actually don't have ANY enforcible Human Rights in Australia... sorry, just the way the Federal and State Keystone Kops like it!

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