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thanks sydney. all telstra have to do is get back to negotiating.
Another of Sydney's comments defending the almighty tyrant "T" against people who are being treated like dirt. You sound like a supporter of Palin in the American pres campaign. I know a few Telstra employees who just want to leave because the pressure upon them to do their job for crap is fairly intense. When do you remember the last time Telstra had to deal with strike action by the way. One that actually got to strike.
Again I say Trujillo you are a mongrel & may the dogs take you down. Go back to the states. Just go away!
You sound like one Rex!
I work for Telstra, I joined 12 years ago on a $35,000 union controlled salary, after 3 years I hadn't even hit $40,000 all thanks to the unions and awards, I moved to an AWA when it was offered and am now on over $120,000 and still in the same role I was when I started. I am a hard worker and they recognised this by giving me big pay increases as a reward.
Seeing it first hand I know the only thing unions encourage is laziness and negative sentiment.
There are people I work with who are union members and are paid award rates who will start turning off their computers at 4pm so they can leave at 4:36pm (union mandated time). They don't care if they are in the middle of something as they will just start it the next day.
I am at work at 8am and log on immediately, I will work until about 5pm and do about 40% work productive work each day then the average union worker.
Most of all I am happy coming in and happy leaving as opposed to my whinging union brainwashed colleagues.
A fantastic response - sadly that will be shot down by Telstra fanboys.
I've been trying to reason with these people for a long time Paul but they just don't understand. I am glad that there is someone out there that thinks like me but the trouble is that some people just can't be told, no matter how many times their heads are knocked against heavy blunt objects.
Sounds like a bit of a generalisation and union bash to me Paul. You say you are 40% more productive than union workers. You can measure this or is just your own puffed up self importance?
I had a different experience at Telstra, I found mid and senior management wanting. It was a den of nepotism where you were required to attend the right catholic school to get promotion above a certain level. Sure, I met some lazy people but that had nothing to do with unionism.
Finally, the teams I worked with were union members (as I was) and we ceratinly completed tasks before leaving work and rarely left before 530pm. You are very lucky to be only working 8 to 5, where i work now, that's called a short day.
These were actual measured results based on service orders that I processed on average last financial year. I processed 38 individual orders each day whereas the team average was 32, union members were 27, AWA employees were 36 on average.
8 to 5 was a general figure, my train arrives at 7:40 so I start at around 8 and I will often stay back to complete a couple of extra orders while the phones are not ringing.
I am not in any form of management and I do agree that Telstra has a lot of nepotism but then again how many companies don't?
if a union member get only $40k and you are on $120K , basic maths says you should actually be churning out 3 times as many orders as them, shouldnt you?
so if they do 27 you should be doing 81, not 36. obviously you are underperforming or you are simply overpaid in comparison and shareholders should rightly call for an immediate review.
in light of this, its obviously time for a pay reduction for you underperformers, fairs fair.
I was talking about 1999, I started in 1996 and have been there for 12 years now. My guess is that the union members are on $100,000 plus anyway.
You have been taking lessons from KRudd, hearing what you want and responding in whatever format you think people will accept.
Dollar for Dollar I am certain the non-union members in my area provide far greater value to shareholders then union members.
Your case against me or on behalf of the shareholders is full of holes.
to the obvious hardest worker ever, swiss cheese paul. the only thing full of holes are your figures and subsequent backflip.
i read what you wrote and you were intentionally playing games with figures to make the union look like they were holding you back.
but, you now have changed your tune and say oh while im on $120k the union members are also on $100k plus.
$100k plus what? plus $20k. if not they are perhaps being victimised simply because they are in the union. reeks of howard stench to me.
lets be realistic now, if you were sitting next to a union member, doing the same job but receiveing $10k-20k per year less, would you make an extra effort? No, you wouldn't admit it, youd be **ssed and screaming unfair union bully. but when the boot is on the other foot it all ok. so id like to know particularly if union members are being victimised and intentionally paid less, seems so. but as long as youre ok though, ***k the rest hey paul. that's the spirit.
i'm sure telstra shareholders would love to know what it is you do for your $120k paul. so with your attitude of im ok ***k you jack, dont come crying when telstra shareholders put pressure on earnings and telstra decides to outsource your $120k job abroad, where theyd do it for a third of the price!
you know what they say about choosing to live by the sword.
Reading all of the above you are the one obviously selecting what you want to read and acknowledge. There is nothing stated by paul that contradicts himself and you are simply sour that someone puts forward a real life case that disproves your whole argument.
Cheap insults just shows how low unions will stoop, I am sure if you knew where he worked you would try some union stand over tactics to get him to shut up.
I notice that none of the wonderful union members are standing up and saying how wonderful they are being taken care of by you and your stooges.
I will start preparing your tombstone...
2008
RIP
UNIONS
Here lies the union movement, where they belong, spending eternity with the rest of their maggot family.
clown.
the irony of you being a clown is that you dont even realise you are one, although the big red nose should be a giveaway.
clown you call me a *union jerk* and *maggot family* then have the hide to say *cheap insults just shows how low unions will stoop*. how low clowns will stoop perhaps. hypocrite.
yes please get that tombstone ready. it can sit next to howard and the rest of you clowns, thrown out of power simply because of your obvious hatred of your fellow employees/australians, who just happen to be in an association called a union.
more irony clown.
just the associations that brainwash them
i agree with rule 5.
so lets start with your brainwashing association called the liberal party.
LMAO
I voted for the other side loser. Again uneducated, uninformed and uninspiring comments. Typical loser union garbage.
Farewell for now - I'll think of you and your movement each time I drive past a cemetery.
you are anti union but voted for the union lovers! hahahahahaha
just shows what a complete **ckhead you must be.
say hello to dishan, your indian replacemnet for me **ckhead.
quote - 'I am sure if you knew where he worked you would try some union stand over tactics to get him to shut up'.
you are obviously most bright. instead of frothing at the mouth with stupid howard/reith type rhetoric, go back and read again.
straight up, he, paul, clearly states he works for telstra and has done for 12 years. DER
so if you can actually read, you should then learn a little comprehension, that way your foolishness may not be quite so obvious.
of course you could always do as you normally do, just crawl into the bosses office and beg him/her to explain it to you.
Worked for Telstra for 12 years, was on $40,000 9 years ago, has tripled salary in those 9 years. Don't try to pretend that your wonderful union negotiations could not have achieved similar results for their members in those same 9 years!!!
Your logic completely failed, in one hand you say unions help but in the other hand you are claiming that the salary is higher for a non-union member courtesy of leaving the union movement.
I will now walk away knowing this you just lost the game!
whatever, believe what you want. lost the game, in your own feeble little mind, liberal stooge.
i look forward to your job being outsourced to india. haha
Paul,
I am sure you negotiated you $120,000.
The ECA's are not negotiated!
If Telstra would just sit down and talk to the employees representative they might be able to work something out.
How can anything progress if Telstra will not talk.
What? give Telstra management a blank cheque on NBN rollout? Why would Telstra choose to instigate an atmosphere of hostility with its employees when it has commenced a "do or die" offensive on the NBN battlefield?
The same staff that lay at the core of its proposed delivery plan on the NBN bid?
I also doubt that a majority of Telstra staff earn more than a quarter of 210k pa. Many will be battlers like the rest of us trying to survive in this difficult times. Many of its employees will be either Telstra shareholders and or customers like many of us in Oz and its their constitutional right to choose representative negotiation if they wish. I think Telsra should rethink the path its embarking.
Rex Alfie Lee don't be insulted but I think your remarks are a little over the top. With respect, I think that you are being consumed by an irrational hatred that will certainly destroy you before it concerns Sol.
Paul, Telstra is exceptionally blessed to have an employee like you and Australia would be blessed also if more Australians had your attitude.
telstra has a policy of not promoting staff on union contracts... so all those hardworking union ppl, receive bupkiss for there hard work, cant blame them for lying around and doing the bare minimum, why do extra work for sol to get a shinier car?
They could opt to move away from a union contract and become like all of those other people who are willing to work an honest days work for an honest days pay.
UNIONS = WE DON'T WANT TO O WORK BUT WE WANT ALL THE BENEFITS ANYWAY
lol, only works if the big companies honest themselves... if you wont work for less, we'll fire you, its okay, your replaceable, oh wait what, all 500+ of you are in this together, well hmm 500 are a bit harder to replace, perhaps we'll have to only fire you based on bad work, not doing the same work for less... if telstra wants more work done then they should pay us more, I'm certainly not gonna do more work for the same pittance, I'll give them the amount they require to get the job done well and they can pay me extra if they want extra
The whole game unions play is that they encourage a herd mentality where anyone willing to go that little bit further for their employer is ridiculed. By allowing individuals to work harder knowing that they will be rewarded will mean the end of union dominance. The unions are not defending their member's right's they are defending their ability to hold employers and hard working employees to ransom.
when the chips are down and management decides, as they always will, that although you believe you are perfect and irreplaceable, you are actually expendable, who you gonna call, ghostbusters?
no youll go *ALONE, without the herd* crying to the only people who will care and be willing to help you and guess who that is, bright spark?
They will dump two types of people, the ones who want a golden handshake and the ones who are under performing. I have seen the process first hand and know that being in a union will actually work against you when they are handing out redundancies. Real solid workers have no fear because they are the ones that are valued by their employers (unless management are in union pockets).
yes im sure you are the pinnacle of perfect employees. marvellous how far the old tongue down the back of the trousers will get you and you are the obvious proof.
he anonymous, great comeback, just proves that when union supporters have no argument they just stoop to stupid insults and comebacks that even a 3 year old would find lame and stupid.
obviously you are a 3 year old then, clown.
I've been involved with unions since the 70s and I can assure you that I work as hard as the next person. This applies to most people I have worked with over the past 35 years as well. I have always (as a paid up union member) done my best to provide value and grow my employers business. As a union organiser (delegate, president etc) I was never involved in any sort of bullying tactics or behaviour and had positive, productive relationships with the employers.
Stop making stupid generalisations about something you have very limited experience with.
And we would expect you to say anything else?
What a load of cr@p
would it make you feel better didums if we just said you are the hardest worker ever?
put the tissues away now. idiot.
Are you worried there won't be enough for you?
The great thing is that union membership is declining with each year's intake into the workforce. By the time the 40 somethings workers are approaching retirement in the next 1 or 2 decades the union movement will be as good as dead.
Is that what you are worried about?
A bit like climate change ... see the effects and do nothing until it is too late and then wave your arms, kick and scream thinking you can still get things back to the way they were.
People cry for 4 reasons ...
Sorrow - I cry for your loss
Pain - The entire union movement is a right royal pain
Irritation - Look in the mirror you will see what I mean
Laughter - All the way to the bank
p.s. - the union movement is much closer to fascism - the word is derived from the Italian word fascio which is translated to English as UNION!!!
thought you were walking away ***head, liar too i see.
dont know where you get your figures from benita, oops benito, but didn't rudd get elected and it has been proven, because of howards anti union awa agenda. ask the lads down at liberal hq, on the sly and theyll tell you old chap.
you cry for 4 reasons ...
Sorrow - because howard was dumped for the PRO UNION rudd
Pain - seeing the look on your messiah, howards face when dumped.
Irritation - Look in the mirror you will see a) a child, b) moron, c) ***khead, d) an IT idiot geek who only knows pc/mac and his joystick, nothing from the actual world e) all of the above - i've got my money on e.
Laughter - when ***khead, without a united workforce and able union leadership, YOUR JOB is outsourced, no not india, but to the phillipines, haha
http://apcmag.com/bigpond_talk_to_a_computer_then_the_philippines.htm
union: a combination so formed, especially an alliance or confederation of people, parties, or political entities for mutual interest or benefit.
that would make you precious liberal party a UNION, haha ***khead.
The wan*er assumes everyone against unions is a Liberal, guess what they are not! I voted against the Liberals last election and I would do it again if I thought they were not the best party on the day. Someone who votes for a party votes for many reasons and not simply on one policy. If you voted for KRudd for that one reason and that one reason only then you are a narrow minded bigot who has no idea what is in the best interest for all of Australia.
I've got to run now getting a bit of a bowel movement, as I flush I will wave goodbye to you ........ again!
if you had a bowel movement there'd be nothing left of you , because you are full of ****
also, prize your hane from your joystick and wave goodbye to YOUR JOB, as it goes to the Phillippines, ***khead, haha.
come on guys, lets face it, unions are there to do one thing:
-provide fair working conditions for EVERYONE
- A rate of pay you can afford to eat on regardless of how much they produce - I'm sure you've all worked with someone who is just not equipped to do as much as you are but works hard, or well equipped but too lazy (i know which one of those I'd rather pay more), either way they both deserve to be able to eat and feed and clothe their kids.
- Safety so everyone gets to go home
Where the wheels fall off is that unions have an inherent case of "tall poppy" syndrome - if you don't want to be joe average you're made an outsider - that's what unions do, they promote average by making sure that joe bottom and joe super performer get paid the same as joe average, which is fine - but you tell me, would you hire joe super performer or joe average if you had a choice? I'd just like to see all of you happily pay the telstra bill next time you get a line relocated when it could be 25% less if the entire workforce was made up of joe super performer.
It sounds like I'm union bashing - and i am to some degree, I used to be a chippy, and the hardest working, best chippies I've ever seen were working for themselves on contracts that were productivity based, but I've also seen what happens when safety regs are ignored in the name of speed and it's not pretty. In reality, I think workcover should be erased - it's strangling any trade based industry and unions should restrict themselves to minimum wages and workplace safety as their domains of operation, make sure that people have enough to eat and that they are garuanteed safety, they lost the battle on pay for productivity long ago but those two domains should stay theirs.
Unions have only their members to blame for their current loss of strength, i worked in residential for a long time and didn't believe the stories about union members until i did some commercial work on one of the high rises in sydney and had to lug my tools up the stairs every day because I wasn't a union member and the lift operator was, I've never asked the unions for a thing, i've always negotiated my own pay rates - and at first it was lower than the unions were offering, because I was joe underperformer but eventually it was higher - when I got better, and that's the way it should be, i don't want to be joe average so I shouldn't be paid like him.
And for those of you who are afraid of offshoring, don't be afraid of it, use it, get another job that can't be offshored - and in 20 years offshoring will go full circle, indian call centres are no longer cheap because workers there want all the things we want - nice cars, nice houses, to eat nice food, and they're still cheaper, but the gap is closing, more high paying jobs mean a larger middle class so in 20 years india will be too expensive and the jobs will come back, it all balances out, it actually hurts the economy, drives up prices and puts companies out of business when you tell them they have to pay more for something than an overseas competitor is.
Maybe I'm wrong, comments?
I think that connection cut-outs will be more common if the CEPU goes on strike.The lines might be disrupted by maintainence delays caused by the strike,which may have big problems.2/3rds of the country depends on Telstra and if the lines cut out, it could be like a self inflicted media censorship and also,has anyone had thier internet modem shut off then turn on again? Its been happening very frequently at my house, and can barely surf the net, with the cut-outs, so if anyone has this problem, please advise your local line interchange.
as most qualified technician from new delhi perhaps i am to fix your drop outs? telstra has offered me many jobs, but i turn them all down as i no want to stay in india answering phones, i want to build cables for customers! perhaps i is to also build australia NBN?
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Here we go, back to the past. Train drivers in Western Australia on $210,000 a year and are striking for more. Telstra members demand your representatives fight to have Telstra win the NBN contract and then have negotiations with Telstra to get a fair and decent pay rate for your labour.