Nokia Australia aware of phone faults for six years: source

By Andrew Colley
12 November 2001 10:30 AM
Tags: nokia, 8210, mobile phone, defect, lcd, morgan, handset
Nokia is allegedly aware that it has been selling mobile phones with inherent design faults, according to a former employee of the company. The allegation has been supported by an independent mobile phone repair service, Melbourne-based Phone Medic.

A former employee of Nokia Australia, who asked not to be identified in this report, has alleged that the company lied when it said it is unaware of the extent of an apparent problem with its handsets.

As reported by ZDNet Australia last week , several customers have complained that the liquid crystal display (LCD) on Nokia's 8210 mobile phone intermittently fails to function, a problem that alos appears to be inherent in several of the phone manufacturer's previous models.

The ex-staffer, who is anxious to stress that he maintains a good relationship with the company, further alleged that the design faults affect a broad range of Nokia handsets built after the company retired the Nokia 2110. This suggests that the company may have failed to address the alleged design flaws for up to 6 years.

Supporting the former employee statement, Adrian Morgan, spokesman for independent mobile phone repairer Phone Medic, says that the 8210 malfunctions when rubber connectors sandwiched between the phone's LCD and its circuit board fail. He says the problem is not new nor isolated to the Nokia 8210, but inherent with all handsets that use the rubber connector, including the 3210, 5110, 6110, 8850 and models carrying other brand names.

"The first model we can recall having this problem with Nokia, was the 5110. After about a year of moderate to heavy use, the conductive rubber compresses and wears indented bands on the circuit board end," he said. "Earlier on, Ericsson used the same connectors in both the LCD and microphone and these connectors also failed after time or heavy use".

Nokia released its 5110 and 6110 handsets early in 1998.

Morgan thinks that Nokia's awareness of the problem is self-evident. He said the company has attempted to rectify the problem in recent models of its mobile phone range.

"They've actually changed the [allegedly faulty] part in the 3310 and 3330," he said. "They have done away with conductive rubber connectors, and used metal contacts that are spring loaded".

Morgan's experience with the handsets suggests that Nokia's decision to release the flawed handsets on the market was a case of mismanagement rather than misconduct.

"I believe that in normal use the part should last, but I think Nokia underestimated the usage that people are giving the phones," he said, when asked why the handsets hadn't been recalled.

He says that the phones LCD is sensitive to pressure and after-market phone accessories, such as non-genuine leather cases and clip-on housings could be contributing to the high incidence of LCD failure among them.

"On some occasions, we have suggested to people that have pulled their phones out of very tight pockets such as jeans, that perhaps they shouldn't keep them there," said Morgan.

If, as Morgan believes, Nokia is trying to address the LCD design flaw, doubts remain as to whether the new part will do so, and the phone maker may soon find that it's caught between a rock and a hard place.

"In doing this [changing the part], we have had several of them [3310s and 3330s] in for repair with the metal contacts squashed and broken, and a few with cracked LCDs, " said Morgan.

"We rarely have to replace an LCD on an 8210 because it has cracked, so the conductive rubber concept seems to be protecting customers and Nokia from more costly repairs. Perhaps with the 8210, Nokia has used a slightly soft conductive rubber to protect the LCD, and it is wearing faster than one which was a little firmer."

This suggests that Nokia has been grappling with a difficult dilemma; a "firmer" substance will last longer but poses a higher risk of cracking the LCD.

Offering an explanation for the mobile phone industry's silence on the issue, the former Nokia Australia employee told ZDNet that the phone maker has such a strong monopoly over the Australian mobile phone market that its trading decisions can adversely affect service providers and individual dealerships' ability to operate.

When ZDNet Australia contacted Nokia to again discuss the reader backlash and the allegations, the company stood by assertions it made last Wednesday that it is unaware of any inherent fault with its product.

"All that I can go on is the figures that we've got and based on those I stand by the previous statements," said Nokia corporate affairs manager, Anthony Wilson. "Based on our volumes the problem is not widespread."

Nokia's argument is not likely to satisfy many disgruntled owners who claim to have experienced a high incidence failure with the 8210. They have reacted angrily to the company's business-as-usual response to the problem.

"I bought 18 Nokia 8210s in December last year and not long after I had to return 5 because the wires connecting the hands free socket to the base of the phone were never connected properly. Subsequently I have sent 7 phones back to have their LCD screens fixed," said Melbourne-based IT Manager, Martin Curlis. "If this is 'no more than usual' I will be certain never to buy a Nokia again."

The vast majority of feedback that ZDNet received echoed Curlis' complaint. One reader said that seven out of ten of his associates owned Nokia 8210s and that of that, group nine had had screen problems; at least four of those must have been Nokia 8210s.

"For Nokia to say that this is rare, is a joke," said one Sydney sales executive.

Some customers are starting to doubt Nokia's ability to manufacture handsets of an acceptable quality to operate throughout the term of their mobile service provider contracts, and their experiences corroborate allegations that the problem is widespread and that Nokia is aware of it.

"I've had three 8210s fail in the 13th month (one month out of warranty). Luckily because the problem was so well known our supplier fixed them at no cost."

After reading the feedback on ZDNet Australia, Nokia seemed to approach the task of appeasing Nokia customers with renewed enthusiasm. Nokia's Wilson said that the company takes the complaints "very seriously", urged customers experiencing difficulties with the company's mobile phones not to hesitate to come forward.

Nokia's customer care service can be reached on 1300 366 733.

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Talkback 32 comments

    I had one 8210 and one 8850 fo ...Anonymous -- 12/11/01

    I had one 8210 and one 8850 for personal use. The 8210 have 2 time LCD problems with in the first year and the 8850 have been back to repair 3 time in the first 6 months with 2 time is LCD related. Futher more, the 8850 has been back to repair/replace another 2 times in the next six months making up total of 5 times in first year with 3 times LCD related problems.

    I am sure I will not buying another Nokia's phone unless they can prove to the consumers that put their act together and at least, not lie to them.

    No problems here with 8210. I ...Craig Bailey -- 12/11/01

    No problems here with 8210. I owned one for over 12 months before i upgraded to a 9110i - which is still working quite well.
    These products are not rubber balls folks - maybe people should look at the sort of use and/or abuse that they are giving their equipment.

    I have had a 5110, 2 3210s and ...Anonymous -- 12/11/01

    I have had a 5110, 2 3210s and an 8210, and have had the same fault in all of them, but it was worse in the 8210. Most of my associates have had similar problems, apart from anyone with 3310/3330.

    I managed the mobile phone rep ...Anonymous -- 12/11/01

    I managed the mobile phone repairs for a large company. We had many Nokias and Erricson phones. Nearly one in two Nokias went back for repair. The erricsons just kept going. The Nokia 2110 was quite reliable but the Erricsons still out lasted them. We had one Motorola flip phone which spent more time being fixed then in use. Still I have had my phone for 13 months with no fault, that is about as long as you would want to keep a phone these days.

    Nokia's service is disgraceful ...Anonymous -- 12/11/01

    Nokia's service is disgraceful! I had an 8110 which had to be replaced 12 times! Nokia denied any known issues with the software on the phone, but everyone else I had spoken with who had come into contact with an 8110 complained about the same problem as me. Nokia bumped me off, ran me around, gave me poor service, and basically ripped me off. I felt lied to, cheated, and extremely annoyed with Nokia.

    Manufacturers MUST make phones that are able to sustain a *bit* of handling for the duration of most contracts (which is now up to 30 months)! A twelve month warranty is useless... Unless the communications carriers start producing reasonable rate plans with only 12 month obligations...

    I cant believe it! If Microsof ...Anonymous -- 12/11/01

    I cant believe it! If Microsoft put out software that had this sort of fault we would crucify them wouldnt we? Oh but I am sure that they would fall all over themselves to fix it anyway.

    My 8210 needed screen repair w ...Anonymous -- 12/11/01

    My 8210 needed screen repair within 9 months. Being small, it does get shoved around and fair wear and tear is expected. But this sounds like a systematic error - that Nokia should be seen to correct.

    At work here we have a box ful ...Anonymous -- 13/11/01

    At work here we have a box full of 5110's and 5120's that have intermittant displays. Its go to the point with these phones where a local asian phone accesory place will fix it for NZ$20 on the spot if they are not busy.

    They can blame leather cases and other face plates, but there is a metal surround around the screen, I cannot see how any pressure can be applied to the screen from these accesories.

    Re the LCD screen failures, as ...Anonymous -- 13/11/01

    Re the LCD screen failures, as a purchaser of 100s of Nokia mobile phones per year for a Company, yes there is a problem.
    I was led to believe the problem was an IC by the Telstra State Repair Centres.
    Generally, the 5110 screen fails not long after the phone is out of warranty however, on some it does fail after 6 - 8 months.
    To be fair though, it is a good phone in terms of cost and battery life.
    The Nokia 6110s and 6150s, which I also purchased all had problems with screen displays disappearing and the phones dropping out. In my view this model was definately a lemon.
    The 6210s seem to be OK so far.......
    So why do I continue to buy Nokia's mobile phones ?
    I or anyone can pick up almost any late model Nokia phone an easily navigate the menu without having to sit down and 'read the instruction book' In my Industry this is a definate bonus.
    As for Ericsson, on past experience I would not have them if they were supplied for $0.00.
    Not worth the trouble and now that the actual manufacturing is being outsourced, if you can't get right under your own roof, well what hope is there ?

    Lets face it, the digital mobi ...Anonymous -- 13/11/01

    Lets face it, the digital mobile phones are no where near as reliable or 'strong' as their previous analogue counterparts.
    I had several analogue phones, they were dropped
    etc etc - No problems, yet a digital, drop it once and your off to the repair centre.
    As for Nokia, lets face it they have an enormous portion of the market in Aust (world wide also)and they are not about to make any admission of problems or faults.
    Perhaps something for the ACCC or consumer affairs to sink their teeth into ?
    Nokia are well adapt to shrugging off the individual legitimate complainer.

    We are all forgetting what awe ...Anonymous -- 16/11/01

    We are all forgetting what awesome technology has gone into these phones!! The smaller the phone the more fragile it becomes to some degree. Every Electronic engineer knows that when designing any quality product, that there must be some weakpoints to protect other components from breakage. Especially in portable devices such as Mobile phones. The LCD problems that most people are facing are very simple connection problems and in most cases have probably saved their glass LCD screen from breakage at some point. These devices are fragile and mostly are treated no better than a wallet or a set of keys. Lighten up and enjoy the fantastic technology Nokia have brought us! Nothing manufactured is perfect. This of course does not excuse bad service or getting the run-around. I've heard mostly of good service in Brisbane and most problems rectified immediately with Nokia phones.

    I agree with Rossco. The Nokia ...Anonymous -- 16/11/01

    I agree with Rossco. The Nokia 8210s are an amazing piece of technology. Can everyone remember when they came out how shocked the market was that something so small and sophisticated could be produced. I also agree with Antony Wilson's comments about the amount of Nokia 8210s in the market. Just about everyone has them now, they're everywhere and just about every mobile phone ad in the paper is for a Nokia. So of course it's going to look like there are more faults than an Ericsson or a Motorola etc..

    I have an 8210, and it has had ...Julian Wozniak -- 16/11/01

    I have an 8210, and it has had the screen problem twice. The first time it was fixed, it was said it would not happen again. This was false, with the problem happening again 3 weeks later.

    Rossco, new technology in a mo ...Anon -- 18/11/01

    Rossco, new technology in a mobile phone doesn't excuse poor design on a known problem.

    Nokia don't make phones, they ...No Nokia for me -- 19/11/01

    Nokia don't make phones, they have been outsourced from the 3810/8110, R&D is outsourced, manufacture is outsourced, even dealer reps are outsourced. At least Ericsson do their own R&D, and admit when a phone has a fault by extending the warranty and finding a cure for the problem (yes, the T28 powered odd issue).

    >We are all forgetting what ...Steven Schust -- 20/11/01

    >We are all forgetting what awesome technology >has gone into these phones!!

    No one is forgetting !

    >The smaller the phone the more fragile it >becomes to some degree. Every Electronic >engineer knows that when designing any quality >product, that there must be some weakpoints to >protect other components from breakage.

    Really, then maybe Nokia should plast the "weakpoints" of their phones on the package for ALL to see!

    >Especially in portable devices such as Mobile >phones. The LCD problems that most people are >facing are very simple connection problems and >in most cases have probably saved their glass >LCD screen from breakage at some point.

    No one is saying that they are NOT simple connection problems, they just want Nokia to admit there is a fault with the LCD !!!

    >These devices are fragile and mostly are treated >no better than a wallet or a set of keys.

    Stop defending a mobile defect ! Most people (other than kids) treat thier phone very well.

    >Lighten up and enjoy the fantastic technology >Nokia have brought us! Nothing manufactured is >perfect. This of course does not excuse bad >service or getting the run-around.

    Lighten up NOKIA and admit there is a fault ! Lighten up NOKIA and replace LCD's at no charge....Lighten up NOKIA and admit how many people have returned mobiles !!!

    >I've heard mostly of good service in Brisbane >and most problems rectified immediately with >Nokia phones.

    You don't happen to work for Nokia..hmmm ?

    I have owned a 5110 for just o ...Anonymous -- 30/12/01

    I have owned a 5110 for just over two years. Recently the screen has started to blank out. Other friends have had the same problem, although their phones were still under warranty when the problems started. I rang the Nokia service line about this problem and was told; "this isn't a normal problem for the 5110". If they knew about the problem 6 years ago I don't think I should be the one to pay for the repairs.

    To Rossco and John and any oth ...Anonymous -- 11/02/02

    To Rossco and John and any other thinly disguised Nokia employed crusaders, I don't spend a hundred bucks a month to be a guinea pig for Nokia's engineering department. The corporate ideology should be "Get it right before you inflict the consequences of your teething problems on the consumer." I've ended up getting the run-around from Nokia's "customer service representatives" who just lie straight down the phone & refuse to put me through to anyone who is accountable. Same for my carrier, although it's not really their fault, I guess. Don't bite the hand that feeds you applies to the heavyweights, too. No-one is immune from this level of customer dissatisfaction. My 8210 is a lemon. So was the 3210 before it. Even my 5110 had its issues. Why did I stick with Nokia? Because I was a sucker for the aesthetic appeal just like millions of others and naiively believed they would rectify the design problems in each subsequent model (as they have finally done with the 3310 or whatever - fat load of good that has done me! Too little, too late.) So what if it's small and "an amazing piece of technology" - I'm paying good money for functionality, not just whiz-bang novelty value. Ten years ago, a phone the size of a house brick was an eye catcher. That's just progress. But I digress, and have to get back to work so I can pay for that bloody phone.

    I've been a long term Nokia us ...Anonymous -- 13/02/02

    I've been a long term Nokia user and fan. They've always had the best looking phones and a full complement of features. I've owned the 101 (Analog) a very early digital that I can't even remember what it was called (came in an optus Freestyle package) two 5110's and now 4 6150's!!!. Why 4 6150's do I hear you say? Well because the screen failed on EVERY one of them. The 6150 was my companies standard phone and there are HEAPS of these things that had the same problem. Just yesterday my latest 6150 had the screen fail and now the company allows me to purchase my own handset on the corporate credit card, I'm sure I'll enjoy my new Ericcson T65 when it arrives on Thursday. It's the first time I've bought a non-Nokia phone and unless they fix their design flaws it won't be the last. I followed all the other employee's given the same option after their 6150 failed and went to Ericsson.

    My Nokia 8210 has had screen f ...Simon Ilsley -- 11/03/02

    My Nokia 8210 has had screen failure 3 times and I have had absolutely no customer service from Nokia who are in complete denail. I have lots of friends with the 8210 and every one of them has had at least one screen failure. I am looking to approach consumer affairs and would be interested to hear from anyone who wants to complain.

    I have an 8850 where the displ ...Anonymous -- 11/03/02

    I have an 8850 where the display would die anytime you put it in your pocket or it got a bit warm in the sun. Was really annoying me.
    Anyway, once I realised that it was the rubber thing in there that was causing the trouble, I've replaced mine with a piece of the same stuff from a $4 pocket calculator. Hasn't missed a beat since. You get enought rubber to fix at least 3 phones from one Reject Shop calculator.

    8210 Silicon rubber conductor ...torture -- 29/03/02

    8210 Silicon rubber conductor between PCB & LCD r**ted as per always. Where can I get this part from in Australia?

    Kind Regards

    "The LCD problems that mo ...Anonymous -- 24/04/02

    "The LCD problems that most people are facing are very simple connection problems and in most cases have probably saved their glass LCD screen from breakage at some point."

    I fully agree with this but then why when my phone
    was experiencing this problem for the second time did Nokia want to charge me $70 minimum to fix it.
    This was the quote I was given from the lady at the front desk before anyone had even looked at my phone.

    Lucky it was just in warranty and was done for free. If it's just a simple connection problem they see all the time WHY are they charging people out of warranty such exorbitant prices to fix it???.

    Stop crying pls, 3-billions pe ...Anthony T -- 04/07/02

    Stop crying pls, 3-billions people around the world had choosen to use a Nokia fone, they couldn't be all wrong. Nokia is the Mother/Leader in Tomorrow/future Technoloies and ready for today's. At currently I'm personally refused to use anything else but Nokia unless you can convience me any fone that had a friendlier user interface more Fun & small all in one pak.
    It's like any car it required maintenace, it only cost from as little as $15AUD to replace the contact and it good as new, and it would last at least 1yr or more after contact had been replaced all depending on the care/usage of each individual.
    Most shops can offer this service now or email me I'm glad to show where to go.

    My wife has a 8210 and after j ...Simon Frost -- 03/09/02

    My wife has a 8210 and after just over a year the screen has failed.
    I fine it shocking to find that Nokia have not set up a free repair service, after all not all phones are on a contract, I payed 200 pounds for my wifes phone on pay-as-you-go and to be told that it will cost me about 60 pounds to repair by my local phone store make me mad.

    My wife has a 8210 and after j ...Simon Frost -- 03/09/02

    My wife has a 8210 and after just over a year the screen has failed.
    I fine it shocking to find that Nokia have not set up a free repair service, after all not all phones are on a contract, I payed 200 pounds for my wifes phone on pay-as-you-go and to be told that it will cost me about 60 pounds to repair by my local phone store make me mad.

    My wife has a 8210 and after j ...Simon Frost -- 03/09/02

    My wife has a 8210 and after just over a year the screen has failed.
    I fine it shocking to find that Nokia have not set up a free repair service, after all not all phones are on a contract, I payed 200 pounds for my wifes phone on pay-as-you-go and to be told that it will cost me about 60 pounds to repair by my local phone store makes me mad.

    I was the first of a group of ...Anonymous -- 25/06/03

    I was the first of a group of about 5 friends who bought the same model nokia. some time later we all came to a point where we visited the nokia repair centre 4 out of the five of us had the same screen problem all at varying stages ie. mine rarely work, others sometimes worked.. the 5 person had gone swimming with his phone, but thats another story... Unfortunatly mine was out of warrenty but give it was a common problem 4/5 I had hoped it would

    I was the first of a group of ...Anonymous -- 25/06/03

    I was the first of a group of about 5 friends who bought the same model nokia. some time later we all came to a point where we visited the nokia repair centre 4 out of the five of us had the same screen problem all at varying stages ie. mine rarely work, others sometimes worked.. the 5 person had gone swimming with his phone, but thats another story... Unfortunatly mine was out of warrenty but given it was a common problem 4/5 I had hoped it would repaired.. and admitted to as a fault...

    im just another casualty of No ...Adam J -- 15/08/03

    im just another casualty of Nokia, my brother and i both had 8210s which have screwed up. (screen)

    I have a nokia 6081 that does ...Anonymous -- 18/04/04

    I have a nokia 6081 that does not ring and i need someone to fix the problem can any one help

    nokia problems Anonymous -- 31/07/08

    i had a nokia for less than a month and sent it back to the service center in clayton only to be told it it had an unauthorized inspection so i complained to nokia sydney about the way i was treated and they said they would have a rep call me to fix the problem that was 2 month ago still waiting

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