Something old, something new at the ACS

commentary Beginning January 2006, lawyer Philip Argy will step into the lead role at the Australian Computer Society.

Fran Foo A familiar face at the organisation, the senior partner at Mallesons Stephen Jaques has previously served as ACS New South Wales Branch Chair, coupled with several terms as vice president.

He will replace Edward Mandla, whose tenure as president was described as "outstanding" by Argy.

"He's [Mandla] probably spent half his life in Canberra," Argy told ZDNet Australia in an interview. "He's definitely lifted the profile of the ACS."

While the corridors of power were being lobbied left, right and centre, however, could it be that someone at the ACS took their eye off the ball? Membership has fallen by 2,000 during the past two years.

At the end of 2003, as Richard Hogg passed the baton to Mandla, membership stood at 16,000-plus, according to the organisation's Web site and previous press statements. As Argy begins his two-year reign, he will inherit 14,000 members.

Does Argy have what it takes to stop the haemorrhage? To those in doubt and to critics who plan to question the lawyer's suitability for the job, he says he's been a programmer longer than a lawyer, having once served as CIO at Mallesons. "I've got my hands dirty in IT," he said.

While Mandla was bent on recruiting non-IT professionals to the organisation, ie anyone who uses a computer, Argy plans to take a different approach -- his main focus will be to improve the professional standing and qualifications of IT workers.

"Thirty years in law teaches you something about professionalism ... can I imbue [into] IT the professionalism lawyers have been brought up with?

"Professionalism is an important risk mitigation strategy and is critical to ensuring that Australia's ICT sector is held in the highest regard by business, government and industry," he said in a statement.

Argy is certainly entitled to his own views but I'm struggling to decide which is worse -- his suggestion that our IT pros lack professionalism or that the workers can learn something from lawyers.

Do you think Philip Argy is correct in saying IT pros can learn a thing or two about professionalism from lawyers? How do you think he will fare as president? Was Edward Mandla effective during his tenure? Will you be renewing your membership? Write in to edit@zdnet.com.au or talkback below.

Fran Foo is ZDNet Australia managing editor.

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Talkback 17 comments

    AIM is a more valuable institution Robert Brocklebank -- 01/12/05 (in reply to #120124063)

    I have found AIM a more valuable institution than ACS (but not as valuable as SAGAS - Sth Australian Guinness Apprecation Society: yes we exist) :)

    ACS still not relevant Charles Widdis -- 01/12/05

    The question should be ‘how is Phillip Argy going to keep (if not make) the ACS relevant to Australia’s IT Professionals. I’ve been working exclusively as an IT professional for a little over eight years and I guess I’m just missing the point… I don’t understand what value the ACS brings to me.

    I’ve browsed the ACS’ website, tried to take the “benefits” seriously… but I just couldn't find anything that sounded remotely relevant.

    "… guardian of our Code of Ethics and professional conduct and practice within the ICT industry" ... really?

    However, I don’t even think I’d qualify for membership – having only worked in the IT industry for ten years, and with only my experience and some commercial certifications to show for it. True, I’ve managed IT departments in both Australia & overseas… but having worked my way up from the Help Desk, I’m not worthy. I get the strong opinion that unless I have a degree in programming, I’m just not relevant to the ACS.

    Maybe that’s the problem… here we are thinking that the ACS needs to become more relevant to Australia’s IT (semi) professionals… but all along it's us who need to change and become more relevant to the ACS!

    A joke Anonymous -- 02/12/05

    Probably most of us have heard a number of good "lawyer" jokes, maybe with Argy's help and assistance the IT profession can be dragged down to that level

    As an ACS member .... Tony Phelps -- 02/12/05

    Good article!

    As an ACS member, I have wondered what I get for my annual membership fee. I agree with Philip Argy that Mandla has raised the profile of the ACS considerably during his tenure, and if such efforts are kept up it must surely reflect positively on the ACS and (you'd think) consequently on its image in the minds of IT pros. It's my impression Mandla has done a great job not just in Canberra but in the media too. Perhaps their consultant Kerryn Phelps (no, no relation) was worth the money!

    The ACS has long tried to bring in "professionalism", it seems to me, in the strict sense of the term - a code of ethics, a common/standard set of "grades" that let non-IT people recognise a member's seniority or level of accomplishment. The model has always been that of lawyers.

    Now a lawyer is the Big Dog, it will be interesting to see how the focus changes. He's not in the seat yet, and apparently firing off stuff about improving professionalism and IT qualification. His big problem is that the IT industry is rather more fractured than the legal industry - any IT pro has a number of organisations to choose between. I'm also a member of APESMA, and get much more value-for-money from them in terms of professional and lifestyle support/assistance.

    I have to say, I don't feel the appointment of a lawyer, who thinks the IT world needs lawyering, fills me with optimism and confidence for the ACS. I reckon 2 years from now the membership numbers will be down worse... which is a shame, because the ACS is theoretically a great organisation to carry out industry lobbying.

    By the way, I do think IT Pros lack professionalism - but in the same way that lawyers do. Simply ticking the box to say you agree with a code of ethics and that you'll abide by an industry body's rules doesn't make you a pillar of the community. Look at the general attitude to lawyers!

    The lawyer jokes say it all really (you know, the "what do you call 1000 lawyers at the bottom of the sea - a good start" type).

    We shall see what Philip comes up with... keep us in the picture Fran!

    Lost two thirds of their members since 1995 Tony Healy -- 03/12/05

    The decline in membership is even worse than the loss of 2,000. ACS membership was about 15,000 ten years ago, when the IT workforce was one third its current size.

    So the ACS has effectively shrunk by two thirds in that time.

    The reason seems to lie in the way the ACS was captured by non-professional interests, such as lawyers, accountants, recruiters and lightweight academics.

    The ACS expends a lot of effort trying to sucker computer science students into joining, but they seem to quickly realise there's something wrong with the organisation and leave.

    Given the arrogance of Argy's comments, I think his reign will see the ACS nosedive into terminal decline, much faster than I expected. Software professionals are a lot more politically aware and smarter these days.

    Mandla's tenure was great for the recruiting industry and non-professionals in IT, but not for Australian software professionals. It caused a lot of harm to the Australian software profession and ultimately industry.

    the art of billing Ged -- 05/12/05

    Fran, I think the main thing that can be learnt from the legal profession is the art of billing... in six minute blocks... Inflating costs (photocopying, mail, phone, fax)... billing a paralegals time the same as a barrister...

    why be a member? Anonymous -- 05/12/05

    I cannot think of any justifiable reason to want to be a member. That is what the new president needs to solve.

    Fran - Do you belong to a Peter Griffith -- 06/12/05

    Fran, what associations or unions do you belong to, why do you belong to them?
    As Managing Editor, you must consider yourself a professional.
    On what criteria do you base that assumption?
    Of the Associations you do belong to, what do they do for you besides cheap tickets to shows, and other tangible benefits.
    How do they elect their leader?
    If you were in the ICT industry would you join a "professional" association, and which one?

    You look familiar... Anonymous -- 06/12/05

    Yo Peter,

    Aren't you at the ACS?

    Journalists would not tolerate the ACS Tony Healy -- 06/12/05

    Peter, that's not really a good example if you intend to promote the ACS agenda.

    Journalists would never tolerate a body claiming to represent them when it didn't, like the Public Relations Institute for example.

    Most importantly, they would never tolerate a body like the ACS deciding who should and shouldn't work as a journalist, especially when that group comprises less than 10 per cent of the professional workforce.

    ACS is unrepresentative! Anonymous -- 11/12/05 (in reply to #120124524)

    It annoys me as an IT pro of some 15 yrs experience to have an unrepresentative minority group try to dominate & say who can work in the industry. Also for the ACS to define what an IT professional is when they have failed to define appropriate bodies of knowledge is unfair.

    Something old, something new at the ACS Nick Hough -- 07/12/05

    The answer to the lack or the irrelevance of services offered by the ACS is in your hands. Join the Society, be active in its affairs, bring change from the inside.

    Instead all we have above is an outpouring of insults and bile.

    Why do you straw men, hiding behind the Anonymous signature, feel the only comment you can offer on a well intentioned article is to denigrate the person and the profession of the subject of the article.

    By the way, I do believe that Philip Argy was an IT professional before he became a lawyer.

    Too much old, not enough new. Cameron Eldridge -- 07/12/05 (in reply to #120124564)

    I have been a mamber of the ACS. And no i refuse to waste my money. I feel that i can pour $300 per year into better things in life than the non-stop jank mail they send me.

    During my time with the ACS all i saw change was the level of membership, ever decreasing.

    So i ask you the question, why would a join (rejoin) the professional body that is supposed to represent me, only so i can try and get them to change TO actually represent me.

    If the ACS want members, they should be listening to why people are NOT joining not what their elitest members think would be good for IT.

    Who is them? Nick Hough -- 07/12/05 (in reply to #120124587)

    Agree with you Cameron, having been a (since lapsed) member since 1978...

    But who is the "them" that should do this? It can only be the members!

    Responsibility is to expose bad behaviour Tony Healy -- 08/12/05

    Nick, if an organisation if engaging in bad behaviour, it's not the responsibility of critics to join that organisation. A much better approach is to expose that behaviour.

    Joining the ACS would be particularly stupid because it just gives it more legitimacy and more funding.

    Second, it would not be a simple matter of someone just joining the ACS and causing change, because the ACS has a weird voting system that entrenches power with a small clique.

    Most professional societies hold open elections for their office holders. This requires candidates to openly state their positions and be assessed on them, and it means that incompetent or unrepresentative office holders will be voted out at the next election.

    That can't happen with the ACS.

    Nick, Phil Argy is a corporate lawyer. Nothing better illustrates the stupidity of the ACS.

    No value in ACS membership Anonymous -- 10/12/05

    As a first year Comp Sci student, I attended a jointly hosted membership drive of the IEEE and the ACS.

    Memberships dues aside (only a few dollars difference), each question I asked of the IEEE recuiter was met with positive feedback and alternitive options. These same questions were answered with "the ACS can't/doesn't provide that service"...

    At leaste with the IEEE I get some interesting magazines thet fuels my interests in Comp Sci - the ACS offer me nothing in comparison for my membership dues!

    So, for what good reason would I join the ACS?

    IEEE actually better value for money Anonymous -- 11/12/05 (in reply to #120124863)

    I've been an IEEE Comp Soc member for years & get much better value for money than ACS membership. The knowledge community available in IEEE is so broad in comparison to ACS. For member financial benefits APESMA is probably also better value.

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