A new Vista on Linux

A technological safety net
It's important for companies to realise that installing Linux a desktop does not mean a company must go cold turkey on Windows. Even if half of a company's desktops were changed to Linux, lower ongoing management costs could well support an adequate business case to justify making the switch; over time, advanced users' needs, such as process-specific macros and niche Windows-only applications, can be addressed individually.

However, such applications are becoming fewer and fewer with the exception of Microsoft Office; most commonly-used enterprise applications now have a Web interface that renders perfectly well on a Linux desktop. Furthermore, it's worth remembering that even those applications that simply must run under Windows can still be offered to Linux users using time-tested thin-client technology that runs the applications on a Windows server for access from remote desktops.

This approach has proved quite successful for BGC, which despite its open-source conversion realised that many users would still require advanced functionality. Six dedicated servers deliver Microsoft Office and several other applications to users using the X terminal capabilities built into Solaris. Windows applications run in a window alongside the Solaris-hosted tools, giving users the advantages of a stable desktop that also provides access to the applications they need.

"The biggest benefit of this platform is the ability to deploy a much more robust operating environment to users, which translates to a better service level for users without an increase in IT staff," says Buckeridge. "There is some reduction in administration, and we have been able to contain our costs and support many more users [than with Windows]. If we were to do it with Linux, it would be much easier to do today."

The process was not without its troubles: although Microsoft applications are generally written to work well using thin-client software, not all third-party applications are so forgiving. Buckeridge says a few of the company's third-party Windows applications didn't take well to thin-client delivery, with one of the company's Windows 2000 servers "dying".

A coming upgrade to a pair of 64-bit Windows Server 2003 systems is expected to improve the situation but BGC's experience highlights the importance of testing: "It's important that if you're moving to a terminal server environment, you drastically limit which applications are in that environment," Buckeridge warns.

Virtualisation is another way of bridging the gap between Linux and Windows, with products such as VMWare and Xen allowing the installation of Windows under Linux; since those Windows instances are virtual and can be destroyed and recreated at any time, it's possible to carefully manage them to prevent bad behaviour. This approach was used by the NSW Judicial Commission, which recently built its 600,000-page JIRS document management system around Linux desktops and used VMWare to deliver Windows applications to the users.

Linux vendors recognise the potential use of thin-client technology to ease migration from Windows to Linux, and most major distributions include thin-client software. Novell's SuSE Linux Desktop even has two: an open-source client that connects to open-source VNC, Microsoft RDP and Citrix ICA thin-client servers, and Citrix Systems' own ICA client itself. For companies concerned about application availability under Linux, this broad support means setting up thin-client servers is a viable and practical option to maintain backwards compatibility.

Talkback 90 comments

    Linux beating Windows? Big Call... Anonymous -- 10/01/06 (in reply to #120126746)

    The article described: "Furthermore, Linux's lower resource requirements may allow it to run on existing desktops that will need replacement for any upgrade to Windows Vista."

    I believe that this is the only characteristic that Linux may get the go ahead. Most PC's (Greater than 500MHz) generally run todays business applications with little or no problems. If you get a Pentium III-500 with 256MB of RAM, you are set when it comes to Windows XP, Office 2003, Microsoft .NET 2003 etc...

    When Windows Vista's requirements are beyond that of what "standard" onboard video cards provided in Motherboards (ie 32/64MB shared with RAM), and the fact that an AGP video card (starting from $80RRP), wouldn't the IT departments be having fun arguing their case that the general workstation needs a new 128MB Video Card, another stick of 512MB of RAM, just to boot Windows Vista. Take into account that Office 2005 is also completely changed (GUI wise) and there goes the 2006 ICT budget.

    Although I am a linux supporter, in the business workplace, you need to be able to rely on proven technology, and Microsoft is proven, reliable technology. When Office 2003 and Windows XP Service Pack 2 came out, I really thought how good Microsoft actually is. I can't think of a more easier, more productive combination of software. To change that is only going to worsen people's views.

    Anyway, Linux will NEVER dominate the PC market, Microsoft just has too many fingers in too many pies to lose their dominant position

    "Proven, reliable technology", XP SP2 Anonymous -- 10/01/06 (in reply to #120126747)

    "Technology" Windows may be, but "proven, reliable"... well, it mostly is now, but certainly it hasn't been that way for an overly long time.

    About your comments regarding XP SP2:
    If the SP2 transition cannot be described to have been an absolute NIGHTMARE for many IT departments, then I really don't know how to put it differently. Failed upgrades, way too many third-party programs breaking left and right due to many very low-level API changes for increased security, ...

    Microsoft certainly has become much better due to increased heat by Linux competition, but it's still not entirely rosy in Microsoft land.

    Not so sure about that Anonymous -- 10/01/06 (in reply to #120126747)

    Windows will dominate and continue to do so, but I think that Microsoft will either change its ways or die. Why that?

    Vista comes with a two years delay and without several planned features for a reason: closed source development and monolithic engeneering has come to its limits. Opensource development does not only integrate the whole process of development more concise, it is also an investment for the future, because the code is not lost, nor locked away.

    I am quite confident that Linux will continue to grow, just because you have a Darwinistic approach of coding implemented that proved very very effective in developing both universal and specifically adapted "solutions" to the question called life.

    Regarding MS in this respect and the word "dinosour" springs into mind. They were big, they were strong, they dominated the earth, ... they died out because of a single event (or say a few events). If MS does not adapt, it will die out as well.

    Linux has changed peoples minds, it has created a momentum and it has assured that its DNA will be propagated. Even when Linux was bearly usable and lacked a lot more features that it does today, people were constantly imroving it up to the point that it makes a good working day-to-day desktop (I'd personally say that my KDE desktop and Libranet installation is twice as powerfull as the XP Desktop). Linux has created an environment of giving and sharing that is beyond any example.

    I wouldn't even wonder if MS once releases a new version of Windows to the public for free, you might buy support slots in case of any problems. It'll profit from public bug-fixing and you may buy some additional apps. The operating system will be nothing else thatn a marketplace or a platform to sell additional value for it.

    Finally, why Vista? Unless they stop security support, the users can surf, mail, work as they did before for at least another 5 years. What do you do today write letters, listen to music, watch videos and DVDs, make some in most cases rather basic image editing ... unless you aren't a games-addict of a video-producer why would you even need 3D graphic acceleration? Many people I know could do without.

    Vista comes with no real need, it will be a welcome change of "wallpaper" plus it will address some flaws of XP. I am curious of the new concepts and design of Vista, will it be enough innovation for your money?

    Sadly it will come preinstalled as usual and by this penetrate the marked, i doubt that it would do so if it were sold seperately, with XP SP2 at half the price or Linux for free ...

    ben

    Linux at work no way! Anonymous -- 10/01/06

    If you are going to roll out Linux Desktop at your organisation why not throw in a Dvorak keyboard as well and really annoy your employees.

    Maybe in your fish and chip shop.. Anonymous -- 10/01/06 (in reply to #120126764)

    ....with one clueless employee (yourself) but for anyone else out there in the Real World that possess enough smarts to move a mouse and "click" then it makes perfect sense.
    Right now you could substitute an appropriately themed Linux distro (such as Novells SuSe) for XP and most people wouldn't even know the difference (that's most grown-ups in the real world sonny).

    Obviously another clueless Linux Nut Anonymous -- 12/01/06 (in reply to #120126767)

    Not know the difference ??? Which hole have you been living in ??? It makes a BIG difference as both OSes work in a different way. Heck most people have issues switching from XP to Macs (which is the most user friendly OS in the world!!!) so please wake up and smell the coffee.
    But then again this sort of comments is something that is what you would expect from a Linux nut not a Linux user. And yes, there is a difference between the two.

    One day when you leave school you'll realise.... Anonymous -- 15/01/06 (in reply to #120126927)

    You're talking rubbish. I strongly agree with the second poster, he/she is right on the money.

    If any of my staff ever expresses opinions like you're they'd be shown the door, any of the 136 of them.

    Finish your school, get some real world work experience under your belt, be quiet and listen to your elders and then one day you might bo of interest to me.
    Nothing personal.

    Some software works on Linux but not on Windows M Lee -- 11/01/06 (in reply to #120126764)

    We use some specialized software that works on Linux but not on Windows. (It was developed at a university, and we have modified it to fit our needs) So, in our previously Windows-only shop, we now have Linux. I thought the irony was quite sweet. It is also increasingly likely to happen in hi-tech companies.

    Annoyances Charles Hill -- 26/01/06 (in reply to #120126764)

    The point of the article is Windows Vista is going to be a big learning curve and big change for Windows users. Linux is a big change and learning curve for Windows users. Now is a great opportunity to switch them and save a bunch of money, since pain and a learning curve is inevitable.

    Linux...still a long way to go.... David -- 31/01/06 (in reply to #120126764)

    lol..yea well Ive started a new job & at the moment they have Linux installed on all desktops HOWEVER only today the boss asked me to call for a price on a site license for Windows XP. Not having used Linux much before (& that was a few years ago) I must say it does seem quite a stable OS, however I went to install a bit torrent program today & found the program wasnt compatible with Linux. I then went to play a streaming video off putfile.com & it couldnt play it. Im not sure I'd even attempt installing a 3D game on this OS. Nice OS but still a long way off being any real competition to Windows in my opinion.

    BitTorrent Client David Wright -- 01/02/06 (in reply to #120128312)

    Try Azereus, it is has a client for Linux and Windows, and most of the reports I read say Az will download quicker than most other torrent clients.

    But what were you doing installing software on a works machine? That would be a dismissable offence where I work, as would streaming media.

    At home I do use Linux to play media and do most things, I probably use it for around 90% of the tasks I do, Windows is for Visio diagrams and PowerPoint presentations for my seminar at the Uni and games.

    Then your opinion is valueless. Anonymous -- 08/02/06 (in reply to #120128312)

    Windows is a commodity Operating System, ok for using to type up spongecake recipes or send a letter to your grandma but if you use it for anything serious you have rocks in your head.

    In my opinion Linux is eating Windows alive and will continue to do so since the Big Boys (IBM, Novell,Sun etc ) are backing it all the way.

    The amount of development that has gone into Linux in the last 5 years has been phenomonal while Microsoft has just rested on its laurels and allowed Windows to stagnate except for a few eye-candy upgrades occasionally.

    Ignorant windows user... Anonymous -- 21/02/06 (in reply to #120128312)

    Winex/cedaga plays windows games
    xoffice runs office 2003
    linux has no spyware/virus issues

    linux is better designed + more stable.

    Why waste people's time? Rex Alfie Lee -- 10/02/06 (in reply to #120126764)

    Your comment is a waste of space. Did you grow your mind in a flowerpot with fertilizer or are you just plain potty? Why did you write this crap?

    Get a life, you fool,
    Use your nouse, not your tool!

    The tipping point Anonymous -- 10/01/06

    The tipping point of Linux will be when there are good cross platform mail/calendering tools. Most companies will not be satisfied using Outlook on windows and Evolution on Linux. Even though there are plugins to Evolution that would make it talk to an MS-Exchange server, who knows if that plugin works for the next version of Exchange.

    Such email/calendar software will most likely be available in KDE4 as the licensing of QT that KDE is based on then will allow for ports to windows. The current email/calendar application of KDE3.5 allready have a technical edge over MS-Outlook. Combined with a kolab calendaring and messageing server it provides a highly scalable free Outlook/Exchange replacement.

    re: The tipping point Jim Kissel -- 11/01/06 (in reply to #120126787)

    There are at least two cross platform replacements for MS Exchange.
    Zimbra and OpenExchange

    Linux is better than xp and vista now Anonymous -- 11/01/06

    linux is ready for the desktop now and is much better than xp an vista now.

    our work has such a modified image of windows it doesn't even represent windows anymore.

    coporations could do the same with linux. they can have their own image just as easy as windows. I can make kde look more like windows than xp does and the average joe user would not even know the difference.

    it doesn't matter whether vista is a succes or not linux isn't going anywhere and it will always be there as choice. but I can read the next group of articles headlines - "Vista kills linux on desktop" you can never really kill linux it will always be there as a choice.

    I chose linux because I respect my own privacy and I just don't like windows. I just can't trust the software on windows since I can't go back and audit the source code.

    'insert sony drm example here'

    Bad Math Jonny Come Lately -- 11/01/06

    "More than five years ago the launch of Microsoft Windows XP ..."

    My sources say Windows XP shipped Oct. 25, 2001. Today it is Jan. 10, 2006. That's 1,538 days or more than four years ago but certainly no where close to five years.

    Linux better than Windows? Big Call... Craig -- 11/01/06

    It's rather interesting that people are claiming Linux is better than Windows. This statement needs further looking into.

    For Security, Linux is much better than Windows because Linux isn't targeted as much as Windows is. Also, because Linux is Open Source, any bugs can be fixed by anyone.

    For Compatibility, Windows is much better as 90% of shelved items are designed for Windows only. .NET, Macromedia Suite, Adobe Suite are not ported to Linux yet - and I use these myself alot.

    For Speed, Windows is better. Windows doesn't have the tendancy to eat your RAM up. Windows XP can run happily on 128MB of RAM after an installation. Linux runs s#ithouse on 128MB of RAM, and often chokes to the point where it's quicker to press the reset button.

    For ease of use, Windows wins hands down. Try explaining to people who use IT because they have to that usr, bin, mnt, sys, etc, home, "root", etc... are like the directory listings when you double click on c:\. The concept of setting up "root" doesn't go down well for the home user.

    For Price, Linux wins by a RRP of $399+. Nothing more needs to be said.

    Don't get me wrong, I think that Linux has the potential to take over, but more of the bigger developers need to look at developing programs and hardware so that it's 100% Linux and Windows compatible. Remember the days where most hardware was 100% IBM PC compatible?

    Not only that, but Windows Vista's new 3D desktop, their completely redesigned GUI in office 2005, new security flaws etc...

    If Linux is to take over, now's the time to hit them when the general PC owner with their Pentium III's, IV's and AMD Athlon see no need to upgrade their already powerful enough computer, because their current system already authors DVD's, creates letters, plays games and browses the internet.

    What are you talking about ? Anonymous -- 12/01/06 (in reply to #120126863)

    Linux does not use more ram than windows.....quite the opposite..I boot linux up and run it just fine on 4 meg ram.
    There is absolutely NO WAY that Linux uses more memory than XP, you're doing something wrong.
    I run Photoshop 7 just fine on my Linux box, along with most of the Adobe suite... use Crossover.
    Windows has terrible ease-of-use... all the /root /var /usr is a furphy, it's like explaining registry hives to your Granny, it's just never going to happen. Windows is much more complicated than Linux.
    Linux is more secure because it's built that way. Even if Windows had 1% of the market it will always be less secure than Linux because it's just not BUILT RIGHT.

    RE: Linux running on 4MB of RAM? Craig -- 12/01/06 (in reply to #120126916)

    Well, I have tested a variety of Linux distributions on many different combinations, and my test results show that Linux is much slower than windows, and it needs more RAM to function. Why do you think on a small amount of RAM that they have huge Swap drives? You must be running some custom version of Linux that has nothing more than just the Shell system to run on just 4MB of RAM.

    OpenOffice.org on Windows XP boots in 4 seconds. On the same machine under Mandrake, Fedora Core, SuSE, Ubuntu etc... it's about 20-40 seconds.

    I never said that Windows was built right, or that Windows had better security than Linux, but Linux would be just as vulnerable as Windows if Linux was the dominant system! Hackers, Virus Writers etc would find a way to break your system just as they do with Windows.

    Here we go again.... Anonymous -- 15/01/06 (in reply to #120126921)

    "Well, I have tested a variety of Linux distributions on many different combinations, and my test results show that Linux is much slower than windows, and it needs more RAM to function. Why do you think on a small amount of RAM that they have huge Swap drives? You must be running some custom version of Linux that has nothing more than just the Shell system to run on just 4MB of RAM."

    And I have tested every version of Windows ever released and they are all much, much slower than the equivalent age Linux distro. Why else would they need to use up so much RAM to even boot and have such huge swap files? My 64meg Apache servers runs a lovely 64 meg swap partition just fine while any XP desktop you care to mention always swallows hundreds of megs of space.
    "OpenOffice.org on Windows XP boots in 4 seconds. On the same machine under Mandrake, Fedora Core, SuSE, Ubuntu etc... it's about 20-40 seconds."
    Funny, it boots on Suse in about 8 seconds, it takes over 30 seconds on my XP box.
    "I never said that Windows was built right, or that Windows had better security than Linux, but Linux would be just as vulnerable as Windows if Linux was the dominant system! Hackers, Virus Writers etc would find a way to break your system just as they do with Windows."
    How????... I have never EVER even HEARD of ANYONE EVER having their Linux/MACOSX/BSD etc system compromised by just looking at an email or visiting a website, yet this happens MILLIONS of times each day with Windows machines. Unix has been around for 30 years....the hackers should have been all over it by now, if it was possible.
    Face it, Windows is just Swiss cheese and trivial to exploit, *nix is not. Linux is more secure because it's built better from the ground up, it's just that simple.

    Linux never hacked? Anonymous -- 19/01/06 (in reply to #120127185)

    just one of many supporting documents: http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/software/0,2000061733,39116229,00.htm

    Mate, you're shooting yourself in the foot there.. Anonymous -- 23/01/06 (in reply to #120127527)

    even the comments to that story you posted the link too support the anti-MS stand.
    Poor methodology...
    http://www.zdnet.com.au/forums/0,39029293,39116229-20103257o,00.htm

    Didn't you even read what you linked too ??? This guys says it well..

    Some old, same old, nothing to see here...you're like those Creationist guys who stubbornly refuse to accept what's happening all around them and what they can see with their own eyes and have to resort to spin, lies , deciept and deception to bolster their weak positions. I just did my own study* and found that my 100 linux servers were a gazillion billion times more insecure than my powered-down Windows 2k3 machine with no ram or cpu in it (it does have the OEM sticker on the side of the case though) !! Can MS pay me a heap of money for that one too ????

    *Disclaimer:Study does not take into consideration hardware or software factors.

    Windows 95 Specifications on the Microsoft Website... Craig -- 19/01/06 (in reply to #120127185)

    http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=138349

    This states the following:

    Personal computer with a 386DX or higher processor (486 recommended)
    • 4 megabytes (MB) of memory (8 MB recommended)
    • Typical hard disk space required to upgrade to Windows 95: 35-40 MB The actual requirement varies depending on the features you choose to install.
    • Typical hard disk space required to install Windows 95 on a clean system: 50-55 MB The actual requirement varies depending on the features you choose to install.
    • One 3.5-inch high-density floppy disk drive
    • VGA or higher resolution (256-color SVGA recommended)

    Objection to your post Anonymous -- 12/01/06 (in reply to #120126916)

    You said: Linux does not use more ram than windows.....quite the opposite..I boot linux up and run it just fine on 4 meg ram.

    My Response: So did Dos Shell, DOS, Windows 3.1 and Windows 95

    You said: There is absolutely NO WAY that Linux uses more memory than XP, you're doing something wrong.

    My Response: So, running KDE3.3, Gnome 2.6, Firefox, Music playing in the background and Apache running in the background is doing something wrong???

    You said: I run Photoshop 7 just fine on my Linux box, along with most of the Adobe suite...

    My Response: Not on 4MB of RAM you don't.

    You said: use Crossover.

    My Response: Why would you use Crossover? You are just bringing the bugs from Windows into Linux. Besides - the software is still not made for Linux.

    You said: Windows has terrible ease-of-use... all the /root /var /usr is a furphy, it's like explaining registry hives to your Granny, it's just never going to happen. Windows is much more complicated than Linux.

    My Response: Not at all. When CD's are designed with Autorun, a home user puts their CD in, click Set Up or Install or Run, and it works. Also, I would tell my granny that C:\My Documents is where your documents are stored. I wouldn't try explaining that your documents are stored in /home/usr/documents/

    You said: Linux is more secure because it's built that way. Even if Windows had 1% of the market it will always be less secure than Linux because it's just not BUILT RIGHT.

    My Response: If linux was more dominant, you would have hackers and virus writers exploiting Linux - Not Windows. Not only that, but we would be giving Windows a helping hand because they are the poor guy's who need support.

    And again. Anonymous -- 15/01/06 (in reply to #120126923)

    Your points in order.
    DOS, WINDOWS 3.1 are not 32 bit operating systems, Win95 will not function in 4 meg of ram. *bzzzzzt*, try again.

    KDE3.3, Gnome 2.6, Firefox, Music will NOT take up anywhere as much ram as XP with SQlSERVER running, 3 instances of VMWare ruiing Win2003Server and Oracle, Media player and PowerDVD running plus CuBAse and Doom3 (getting the picture yet?) Don't strawman the argument by adding on all the applications and fancy effects to the equation.
    Why use crossover?, why not?..why do you use any myriad of third party tools? It works, its good.
    To install Openoffice on Linux you stick the CD and and click run, to install Enemy Territory you atick the CD in and click run, to Install Doom3 you stick the CD in and click run, to install .....etc etc...getting the picture yet? And you didn't understand the path to the Windows my documents, what is easier /home/user/My Documents or C:/Documents and Settings/user/My Documents???Apart from the fact the Windows one is longer and harder to find they are both on the bloody desktop anyway.
    Linux is inherently more secure than Windows, in fact pretty much anything is more secure than Windows. The idea that other platforms aren't as attacked due to less market share is garbage. Apache + Linuxhas far more market share than IIS + Windows yet less exploits. There are efefctively NO in-the-wild viruses for Linux yet Windows has TENS OF THOUSANDS. No-one even MAKES anti-virus for linux (apart to scan files that go to Windows machines via Linux email servers/SAMBA servers etc just to protect WINDOWS boxes down the line).
    Windows is Swiss cheese...don't bother looking for those people who got their *nix boxes infected by merely previewing an email or looking at a web site, you just won't find them. Ask around though, EVERYONE who uses Windows falls victim eventually, EVERYONE, no exceptions.

    4megs of RAM!? Anonymous -- 17/01/06 (in reply to #120127186)

    My wrist watch needs more than 4 megs of RAM to keep time :P

    who cares about RAM! Anshuman Singh -- 17/01/06 (in reply to #120127335)

    Sometimes, we get too caught up in a millisecond increase in performance when developing software applications. And the same goes for RAM usage. Practically every computer has 256 or 512 MB RAM now (new ones anyway), if not more! So, why discuss if something can run on 4MB of RAM or not. I am never going to use a computer with 4MB of RAM and nor are most home users so no point in discussing this :).
    Though, I don't know about 4MB but I used to run windows 95 on 8MB of RAM when I bought my first computer.

    Windows 95 will run on 4MB of RAM Anonymous -- 19/01/06 (in reply to #120127186)

    I have Windows 95a running on 4MB of RAM.

    That is totally not the point. Anonymous -- 23/01/06 (in reply to #120127528)

    YOu mean you've painfully coaxed it into giving you a desktop after 45 minutes of disk thrashing.

    You cannot do anything meaningful.
    You machine is effectively non-functional.

    Make it boot with 512k of RAM then, or boot it off a floppy ... go on, dare you.

    512k of RAM Anonymous -- 03/02/06 (in reply to #120127766)

    I have to agree that Windows 95 won't load on 512k of RAM, but then again, there is no GUI like Windows 95 that will load on Linux on 512k of RAM thus dismissing your earlier points about comparing the equivalent Linux/Windows. You are comparing Linux in the CLI form to Windows in the GUI form. You must remember that DOS can boot into 512k of RAM and be enough to run Dosshell.

    No no no.. Anonymous -- 06/02/06 (in reply to #120128466)

    You can run a full GUI with 512k RAM, look at the Commodore Amiga for example. Full pre-emptive multitasking in 512k.
    Also, DOS is a pale, pathetic imitation of any of the decent *nix shells.
    Windows technology is simplistic, bloated and primitive, it lacks any sophistication.
    There is no dount we would be 10 years ahead of where we are now computing-wise if it wasn't for the Wintel duopoly.

    yes yes yes... Anonymous -- 06/02/06 (in reply to #120128605)

    Actually you misquoted what I said... "there is no GUI like Windows 95 that will load on Linux on 512k of RAM"

    Windows 95 uses a really simplistic Point and Click system with a 2 button mouse, access to CD-ROM. I know that Commodore had some GUI program that looked like Mac OS 7 or something with an office package. But, why the discussion on RAM I would consider obselete? People are comparing the entire Windows OS to the Linux kernal. Yeah, the linux kernal kicks Window's **** but when it comes to speed with things like SuSE, Red Hat - the default installation of Windows will kick **** compared to the default installation of most linux distros...

    On topic with Vista: With a Video card required, mega amounts of ram etc... I believe that Linux will be much quicker for a short time until a Linux distro made to compete with Vista is created.

    maybe maybe maybe...... Anonymous -- 08/02/06 (in reply to #120128654)

    Commodore has a full pre-emptive multitasking OS with a very nice GUI, full screen video playback at 25fps, stereo sound etc etc that ran in 512K RAM under a 7MhZ cpu and was available in 1985!

    The Windows PC is so backwards it's not funny. Other platforms could do the same job with 1/10th the cpu and RAM that the PC could. Nowadays we just throw insane amounts of memory and cycles at the problem but just imagine if your current spec machine was 10 times more efficient using the same hardware!

    That is the legacy of Wintel, 10 years of stagnation.

    As to your second point, Vista is already dead in the water and it's not even released yet !

    Error in my post Craig -- 12/01/06 (in reply to #120126863)

    Hi all,

    In my above post I said:

    For ease of use, Windows wins hands down. Try explaining to people who use IT because they have to that usr, bin, mnt, sys, etc, home, "root", etc... are like the directory listings when you double click on c:\. The concept of setting up "root" doesn't go down well for the home user.

    It was meant to be non-savvy IT people.

    Linux better than XP Rex Alfie Lee -- 10/02/06 (in reply to #120126863)

    Firstly, your comment that >NET isn't ported to Linux is wrong! It's called Mono & has been put together by Novell using SuSE. You should check your statements before you make them.

    Secondly, you say that Linux is cheaper by about 300 or so bucks. The fact is that there are thousands of dollars worth of software that comes with every version of Linux. That encompasses graphic editing, office equivalents, server software that is set-up with simple checkbox clicking. BTW, on this subject Windows is a long way behind. It's harder to set-up server systems using Windows non-server versions than Linux basic system. Even the professional versions cannot compete with Linux on this one.

    The main reason that Linux is safe from most virus, spyware etc propagators is not as you say because of the lack of following, rather the fact that Linux is based on UNIX which has been around for far more years than has Windows & most of the problems created by nasty software people have been eliminated by the actual structure of UNIX, not as an add-on as it is in Windows. UNIX for the non-UNIXer has a structure that is based upon networking & everything on the network is a file. Everything has a level of power & acces only within that level of power. Yes, it does have some flaws but most of thee were ironed out long ago. Linux security is embedded in the structure not added on as an afterthought.

    Check this out if you have any doubts as to the information.

    The only place that XP has it over Linux is market software choices specific to business software. This is changing because many companies are addressing the needs of Gov't requirements throughout Asia & Europe & so these software choices will soon be up to scratch.

    Where will Windows in its various versions be left then???

    What the? Anonymous -- 13/02/06 (in reply to #120128977)

    You seem to be refering to linux as one operating system. As for .NET, it was ported to linux, and again - from experience still isn't 100%. Windows gives me (and thousands of other users I have helped over the years) the sense that the OS is somewhat more complete.

    More complete what? Rex Alfie Lee -- 15/02/06 (in reply to #120129183)

    How much of Linux have you tried?

    Yes, there are problems with the various Linux versions but that problem is being attacked at this very time by a group working on all of the major versions of Linux other than Fedora. That's Fedora's problem & could ultimately be their undoing.

    More complete in what way? Have you even looked at Linux to know what you are talking about? Perhaps you should take your head out of the sand & watch what is happening around the world.

    SuSE has been given a security clearance making it a usable tool for the armed forces, equal perhaps to Windows, but the version of Windows I would bet has been battened down to the point where network traffic "ain't happ'nin".

    Many overseas Gov'ts are looking carefully at using Linux, not only as the server but also as the desktop because:
    1- It is so much cheaper
    2- It is so much more secure
    3- It doesn't belong to an American consortium (big point here bcoz the good, old US of A doesn't have such a great reputation anymore)
    4- Paying huge chunks of money to a company for very little improvement, namely MS

    Apart from the variances & of course hardware driver problems which are slow forthcoming & installation of a hardware driver is not as simple as it is in Windows, there's not a lot in Windows that is better than Linux. Linux's desktop has been heaps better than MS's for years, even before the millenium.

    Complete Anonymous -- 16/02/06 (in reply to #120129229)

    Ok, first of all, I am an advocate for linux, and I have used many distributions over the years. They all have in their own ways give me (and countless others) the opinion that they are incomplete.

    SuSE is by far the most complete one that I have used (since Novell's aquisition and Version 9), but alot of programs that are bundled with most linux distributions are Beta's, older software, incomplete GUI's etc...

    I admit that Linux has come a long way, and I would like to see it take over Microsoft, but it won't happen until people can look at the operating system and feel confident enough in using it.

    Fonts and compatibility issues are generally the most incompatible layer. Before you start saying you can use "CrossOver" office, Wine, install TTF fonts etc... that's all well and good, but then you really are only installing Windows ontop of linux.

    Here is one question for you to think about. If linux has been so good over the years, and is so much better than Windows - then why the hell do you use Windows?

    The biggest reason I don't switch 100% is because of compatibility issues between programs, and the reason alot of home users don't switch is because they can no longer just walk into a computer store, purchase a CD, pop it in a computer and expect it to work. Until that happens, then Linux is always going to have the sense of incompleteness amongst people.

    I respect your opinion, but no need to have a 'knowitall' attitude. My point referred to general users - not people who live and breathe linux.

    More complete what? Rex Alfie Lee -- 15/02/06 (in reply to #120129183)

    How much of Linux have you tried?

    Yes, there are problems with the various Linux versions but that problem is being attacked at this very time by a group working on all of the major versions of Linux other than Fedora. That's Fedora's problem & could ultimately be their undoing.

    More complete in what way? Have you even looked at Linux to know what you are talking about? Perhaps you should take your head out of the sand & watch what is happening around the world.

    SuSE has been given a security clearance making it a usable tool for the armed forces, equal perhaps to Windows, but the version of Windows I would bet has been battened down to the point where network traffic "ain't happ'nin".

    Many overseas Gov'ts are looking carefully at using Linux, not only as the server but also as the desktop because:
    1- It is so much cheaper
    2- It is so much more secure
    3- It doesn't belong to an American consortium (big point here bcoz the good, old US of A doesn't have such a great reputation anymore)
    4- Paying huge chunks of money to a company for very little improvement, namely MS

    Apart from the variances & of course hardware driver problems which are slow forthcoming & installation of a hardware driver is not as simple as it is in Windows, there's not a lot in Windows that is better than Linux. Linux's desktop has been heaps better than MS's for years, even before the millenium.

    Launch Anonymous -- 11/01/06

    But the Launch of Windows XP's Beta version was much earlier

    Linux is good but still a way to go Anshuman Singh -- 12/01/06

    Finally, I managed to install linux on my laptop since I couldn't really comment on these type of discussions without having any first-hand experience. I installed Ubuntu and it installed without much ado. It had some trouble finding out my wireless card but it was eay enough to set up (though I am an IT professional).

    In my opinion though there is still a way for linux (read Ubuntu) to go before it becomes as easy to use as Windows XP. I had trouble installing stuff because I can't go to a website, dowload an executable and run it. Though some might say that downloading exes is stupid!

    I haven't had any trouble with the UI, software installed on it etc. But, I have had a lot of troubles with installing new software. I seem to get errors to do with dependencies etc. It seems as bad as dll hell (but not quite)! And oh yes - root etc - what the hell is that I was saying to myself a lot. It still has a lot of issues that it needs to deal with and the volume of posts in the forums are a testimony to that with so many users having issues or troubles with the installation and usage of linux.

    But, its free and I wanted to try it. Its good - don't get me wrong. The moment it becomes so easy that one doesn't have to type stuff in command line etc, that will be the day when more users switch to linux. The irony is that linux will have to look and feel and even sometimes use the same terminology of windows to make the transition easier. And if they do that, it would be a lot easier to use.

    Installing software / dll hell Anonymous -- 12/01/06 (in reply to #120126925)

    "I seem to get errors to do with dependencies etc. It seems as bad as dll hell (but not quite)!"
    This is one of the main areas where Linux still has a way to go. I look at a number of distros before I settled on Gentoo because it looks to have this resolved better than most.

    The main reasons I'm using Linux at home though is the cost of the software and stability. I use vmware to launch Windows XP to run a few apps though. I don't expect to upgrade it to Windows Vista.

    UMmm..what ? Anonymous -- 15/01/06 (in reply to #120126943)

    I just don't understand that..

    What's so hard about emerge <package> ?
    or apt-get install <package> ?
    Or usiong the excellent MAndrake, Suse etc file repositories and install managers?
    I haven't had an rpm/deb issue in years...I installed a very old distro of debian..(Bo I think?) then did an apt-get upgrade etc etc went away, came back later and the whole thing was at latest version and workig flawlessly. That's like installing Windows 95, hitting the "upgrade" button and coming back a little later to a fully working, totally updated Vista desktop....it's absolutely amazing!!!!

    You proved my point exactly Anshuman Singh -- 17/01/06 (in reply to #120127187)

    Well, exactly - try explaining "apt-get" etc to a home user! I am a software professional and though you could say that I am stupid or something (though that is unlikely), I still don't understand all this terminology! How about a simple user interface for each software I want to install. Like I said - I like linux but blaming the users lack of knowledge is no way of convincing people to use it. As they say - make it simple and they'll use it. That goes not only for operating systems but every piece of software that requires a lot of user interaction. Maybe windows too is not as easy to use as it should be - but people have been using it for years and so even novice home users can use it.

    No, you're so 1980's...... Anonymous -- 18/01/06 (in reply to #120127345)

    Well, wouldn't it be good if there was some sort of graphical user interface available for Microsofts operating system? I mean, some way of interfacing with it via some sort of pounting device maybe?.. I know it's a crazy idea but hey...wow, a GUI for DOS...oh, my bad, we're not in 1992 anymore!

    Getting the point yet?

    The problem with the Microsoft fanboys is that they continually bring up "problems" with Linux that haven't existed in years. You want to install some software under linux you fire up your GRAPHICAl FRONT END (synaptic or RPMDRake or YAST or whatebver) you click on the package you want and then click on INSTALL.

    If you can't handle that level of complexity then you shouldn't be using a computer in the first place, I mean, seriously how much simpler could it possibly be???

    Lol - gosh it linux a religion! Anshuman Singh -- 18/01/06 (in reply to #120127405)

    Lol - that was my point exactly! Like I said, I like Ubuntu but have found installing software on it very hard. Yes, and I am using the very thing that you are suggesting - I am choosing what I want to install etc etc. But, I am getting lots of errors with dependancies etc. And that is what my point is! I like it but still has a way to go to become as easy as windows (for me that is).
    Oh and as far as being a Microsoft Fanboy - all I'd like to say mate is that this is an operating system - not a religion! People are allowed to critique etc. Like any software, even linux has bugs. And as usual like most people who are linux supporters, you too have tried to say that I am maybe "stupid" to not know how to install software! It is hilarious. Your one-eyed view is so typical of so many linux supporters (not all)!

    Stupid computer users Anonymous -- 28/02/06 (in reply to #120127405)

    >>If you can't handle that level of complexity then you shouldn't be using a computer in the first place, I mean, seriously how much simpler could it possibly be???<<

    You go into the CEO's office (the guy so stupid that he's running the company that is paying your wage) and tell him that he is too stupid to use his computer because he can't work out what 'YAST' or 'synaptic' or 'RPMDRake' are, or what they do. He is just looking for something like 'system updater' or 'latest updates' to update his computer.

    This is a classic example of bad usability. Meaningless names that give no indication as to the function of the application. This could be a good start to improving usability for a general audience (or, in your words, people too stupid to use computers). It seems rife throughout Linux. Cool names for the leet brigade, but terrible for trying to get the OS into the mainstream.

    Attitudes where it is presumed that if someone does not know a lot about computers then they must be stupid are also a terrible impediment to broad usage of any OS. Luckily, the people who have this type of attitude don't get very far up the decision making chain and are usually left as disgruntled employees who never get over thinking that everyone else is more stupid than them.

    Linux is good but still a .... Anonymous -- 30/01/06 (in reply to #120127345)

    I think a lot of you are missing one major area here. Well over half of the calls I get that are not virus / spyware related, are because some user stuffed up installing (or often uninstalling) some crap program from a web site/CD.
    By supplying Linux boxes to your clients, you do a couple of things:
    1. Guarantee yourself some follow up work doing installs/uninstalls.
    2. This will make up for the drastic drop in calls re virus/spyware dramas.
    3. This way, people will think twice before throwing any old thing on their PC, because it will cost them a service call.
    4. You don't need to tell people about /usr, /var, etc. Just tell them to hit "Save" or "Save As" and the system will look after it for them.
    PC's are inherently reliable items - it is the "freedom" that users have to install crap they don't need that causes the majority of the problems.

    Come on Linux!!! Anonymous -- 03/02/07 (in reply to #120126925)

    Linux is MUCH more stable and reliable, software may not be ported, but there is usually opensource software that is similar and gets the job done. I say Come on Linux! Lets Kick Vista out of the competition!

    Windows vs Linux Anonymous -- 13/01/06

    People will always go on about which OS is better.
    I have tried most of the redhat, mandrake etc stuff over the last few years, and they have made great leaps in ease of use and installing it, but there is no reason for the average user to move over. they are comfortable in using windows, and nearly all of the versions of windows have similar options. Microsoft spends millions of dollars on trying to improve the way its products are used and interfaced with, linux does not have this option. Drivers play a big part as well, ms spend money on certifying drivers and hardware to work with windows, again this sort of thing will only be done if anyone in the linux community need the driver or hardware support to run with linux will it be made if its not a common item.

    In the end, untill linux overcomes these issues windows will always be king of the desktop.

    Linux nightmare Anonymous -- 17/01/06

    Imagine the stress on our IT support staff when users come in the next morning after migrating everyone from XP to Linux! We have enough user issues with XP. I hate to imagine the scenario with Linux. Our organisation is full of people who think Linux is the best thing since sliced bread, yet they call IT Support to show them how to insert a table into a MS Word document! HORROR!

    Windows nightmare. Anonymous -- 18/01/06 (in reply to #120127334)

    Yes, I can imagine...
    Imagine all the time they'll have spare once the first few days settle down...as things progress and the benefits of a secure, robust operating system that doesn't need constant babying, patching and attention to run. PC's that won't get compromised by just looking at a website, that won't do down more times per day that a two-penny hooker from malware/spyware and tens of thousands of in-the-wild viruses.

    And the server admins won't know what to do with themselves once they don't need to be constantly testing and applying patches, rebooting serevrs, rebuilding servers...

    It'll be such a nightmare.... for the MS reps.

    Maybe they'll actually get some work done instead of wasting 80% of their time coaxing the poor old Windows boxes along just to ensure they survive another 24 hours...

    Re: Linux nightmare Anonymous -- 06/02/06 (in reply to #120127334)

    So in your organisation training doesn't exist ? You would roll out a new desktop and not issue guidance - well that's a proactive and forward thinking IT support department for you !

    You proved my point exactly Anshuman Singh -- 17/01/06

    Well, exactly - try explaining "apt-get" etc to a home user! I am a software professional and though you could say that I am stupid or something (though that is unlikely), I still don't understand all this terminology! How about a simple user interface for each software I want to install. Like I said - I like linux but blaming the users lack of knowledge is no way of convincing people to use it. As they say - make it simple and they'll use it. That goes not only for operating systems but every piece of software that requires a lot of user interaction. Maybe windows too is not as easy to use as it should be - but people have been using it for years and so even novice home users can use it.

    who cares about RAM! Anshuman Singh -- 17/01/06

    Sometimes, we get too caught up in a millisecond increase in performance when developing software applications. And the same goes for RAM usage. Practically every computer has 256 or 512 MB RAM now (new ones anyway), if not more! So, why discuss if something can run on 4MB of RAM or not. I am never going to use a computer with 4MB of RAM and nor are most home users so no point in discussing this :).
    Though, I don't know about 4MB but I used to run windows 95 on 8MB of RAM when I bought my first computer.

    Every Desktop Computer Anonymous -- 03/02/06 (in reply to #120127344)

    You are ofcourse refering to Deskop COmputer?
    Because hand-held devices, mobile phones, mp3 players have much less RAM. Of course windows xp cant be run on those but linux can. Especially when you have a mission critical device install in your car

    And PocketPC, Windows XP Embedded Anonymous -- 05/02/06 (in reply to #120128493)

    Some phones use PocketPC.

    Proven reliable technology? Anonymous -- 19/01/06

    Oh come on. We all know about Windows "proven, reliable technology" every time we saw a BSoD, every time we read a story about a new virus, a new trojan, every time we paid hundreds of dollars for a new OS and then hundreds more for new programs that regularly crashed.

    Have a look at 3.1, 95, 98, ME and to some extent NT. Where is this "proven" let alone "reliable" technology? They were dogs! Hourly BSoDs, a need to re-install every few months because of OS corruption. I've never had so much as one crash in Linux; not one, never ever. Now that is proven, reliable technology.

    I use XP and Office because I "have to", not because I want to and this is the case for many people.

    You are entitled to your opinion, but you're being a bit of a Peter Pan; you know, the little boy who lived in Fantasy Land.

    Real World Anonymous -- 20/01/06

    Most of the comment on here in support of linux fail to take into consideration the real world. Linux does have advantages over MS Windows, but most of the advantages are ones related to market position. If linux was the dominant OS, then all of the virus's, spyware malware etc would be written to exploit vulnerabilities in the system. And worse than that, how long would patches take to come out once this started happening?
    So whilst there are undeniable advantages, these are all relative to its position in the market.

    Rubbish! Anonymous -- 23/01/06 (in reply to #120127585)

    Why do you people consistantly miss the point? I do not beleive you're really that stupid so I would suggest the local MS shops are directing their employees to post with meaningless FUD.

    The colossal amount of viruses, exploits and worms circulating for Windows is a function of the OS's basic flawed security architecture NOT a function of popularity. Linux + MacOS have about 10% of the DESKTOP between them, so they should have about 10% of the viruses yeah? *bzzzzt* wrong!
    Linux+MAcOS <10 (you could argue that the real number <2 as there's nothing in-the-wild).
    WindowsOS > 65,000 real world, in-the-wild, we-got-one-yesterday-via-email viruses and exploits!
    So stop with this rubbish about how linux and mac would suffer more if they were more popular, they suffer far, far less due to better design, better code and better code review, it's just that simple! Now look in the server-room where Linux/Unix dominates...it's always the SMALLER MARKET SHARE windows boxes that get consistantly pWn3d/exploited.
    MS concentrates on pretty eye-candy and bells and whistles to hypnotise the sheep rather than secure, robust code design to create a superior product.
    Vista is just more of the same...man, it has it's first viruses out months ago and it was effectively still Alpha at that stage! Once Vista is released and the world-wide MS loserfest is but a memory then the bloodbath will begin.
    Anyway, luckily the people with the authority and foresight (the guys in the offices above yours, the ones who direct you to do things for them everyday, the guys with the nice cars..) are now smelling the roses and deserting the MS bandwagon in droves. The last stopouts will be the mental midgets who can't function without a MS Word icon on their desktop but as there's about 5 of them they can wait. The smart money is dumping the steaming MS cr*p-piles out the door and putting in the penguin and there's only more and more of it happening all the time.

    Your full of rubbish Anonymous -- 28/01/06 (in reply to #120127767)

    "So stop with this rubbish about how linux and mac would suffer more if they were more popular, they suffer far, far less due to better design, better code and better code review, it's just that simple!"

    Do you seriously think if the tables were turned (ie Linux had 90% of the market share with Windows at 10%) that Windows would still have 65,000 viruses? I don't think so! Linux would be more attacked because hackers can do more damage. Simple e-mail attachments wouldn't - but the amount of programs usually running in the background of 'general' installations is astonishing. What type of home user needs to run Apache from just a general install?

    I see English isn't your forte. Anonymous -- 31/01/06 (in reply to #120128103)

    Yes, I do say exactly that.

    Windows is swamped by viruses due to a poor security model.

    Here's a hint...google for "dll injection" sometime...then engage your brain cell and have a think.

    Windows is full of holes, it's a poor product, it's based on a bad security model and it's trivial to exploit.

    It's just that simple.

    As for your apache comment...don't install it then. Apache is a third party application anyway. Go on, drop IIS onto your machine as a default install then plug yourself onto the 'Net, see how long you last...I wouldn't give you 30 minutes.

    I know that... Anonymous -- 03/02/06 (in reply to #120128268)

    I know that Windows has many viruses because of the way Windows was made to cater for the new user to computers. It has a native format so that a user can point and click to run a program. Linux is good - don't get me wrong... but viruses are made to destroy a large quantity of computers. If linux was in Large quantity, it would be attacked and brought to its knees. I am glad you don't use any Microsoft products at all.

    What does it matter? Anonymous -- 31/01/06 (in reply to #120127767)

    One would think you have a significant personal or financial investement in seeing the greater public adopt Linux as their preferred OS. I, for one, could care less what OS you or anyone else choose to use and I wouldn't expect you to care which OS I use either - so why do you? You see, that is just it - choice! If the greater public wants to play with 'shiny things', who are you to tell em they can't? You can whine and cry all you like - but in the end, you will go home to a Linux OS, the majority to a Windows OS, some to a Mac OS, and the only clear winner at the end of the day will be your ISP! Give your head a shake and stop over estimating the value of your own opinion - and perhaps ask yourself just why you care so much about conforming everyone else to your way of thinking.

    Not as clueless as you would think Anonymous -- 23/01/06

    FYI, I have more than 14 years in IT working as a consultant with Windows AND *shock horrror* UNIX systems.

    From that experience i can tell you that the only people who get overly excited about Linux are some uni students and people too cheap to pay for software. For the rest of us, its just another operating system.

    Personally I tell people if they are looking for an *alternative* to Windows, go for a Mac. They cant go wrong there.

    Linux is and will always be too difficult for the average joe so long as its path is dictated by geeks and not regular users.

    Nothing personal.

    Well said Anonymous -- 25/01/06 (in reply to #120127786)

    Yep, I'm BCompSc with 10+ years as a Solaris and BSD developer for telcos, and although I use Windows and Linux at work, I use Windows on my noteboook at home and wouldn't dream of spoiling it with any form of *nix. I've better uses for my time, and Windows gives me that time.

    Strawman argument. Anonymous -- 31/01/06 (in reply to #120127786)

    1: I would be very surprised if you were even 14 years old.

    2: When you actually obtain paid employment you'll realise that grown-ups do get excited when they can save hundreds of thousands of dollars in outrageous licensing costs and collateral virus/instability downtime by switching platforms.

    3:Linux desktop development is not driven by geeks and I'm sure Redhat, Novell et al will agree. To add to your strawman argument, even if it was it still wouldn't be such a bad thing when you consider the royal mess Windows has itself in due to pandering to the "ooohhh...look!, shiny thing!" user segment.

    Of course someone with your VAST experience would already know that, right?, right?? I mean, I wouldn't know my a$$ from my elbow since all I was doing was shoving assembler into 12k RAM back when you were in short pants sonny.

    Nothing personal.

    Apple's dark side Anonymous -- 01/02/06 (in reply to #120127786)

    Anyone even considering buying an Apple ought to prepare themselves for what they're really getting into. If you've got a problem, the support is abominable: http://www.apcmag.com/apc/v3.nsf/0/A3F324DDBED1ADBFCA2570F3001E7138

    I haven't found that at all.. Anonymous -- 02/02/06 (in reply to #120128343)

    We're a mainly Apple shop (large graphic design house) and we don't have any problems with Apple support.

    On the very few occasions something has gone wrong our Apple-care agreement has worked fine and we've had either a speedy on-site fix or a replacement unit poste haste.

    So you're saying if ONE person has a bed experience due to a on the surface dodgy type scenario then ALL of apple's support is the same?

    Reminds me of the time I bought that clone PC and when it blew up I got the run-around for weeks, still doesn't mean all Wintel box suppliers are like that.

    Right on! Norm McMillan -- 02/02/06 (in reply to #120127786)

    You are so right...

    If ever Linux is to be "...for the people" as well as "...of the people" this problem has to be addressed. It's just too damned geeky. It'll never "fly" until it's as easy and intuitive to install applications as under ...Windows. (There, I said it!). Perhaps we need some Joe or Jill office workers in the loop?

    Linux is Geeky? Anonymous -- 03/02/06 (in reply to #120128405)

    I don't think you even know what linux is capable of and what flavour it comes in.
    Linux is made for those who knows what they are doing and want to get their work done efficiently. Using Linux is as geeky as using Windows.

    Windows XP a no-brainer for Corporations - really? Anonymous -- 30/01/06

    If it was such a no-brain upgrade why have so many organisations not bothered? It certainly had nothing to offer us that was worth the disruption of a mass roll out.

    Its call Learning Anonymous -- 03/02/06

    This is the computer age. Everyday there is a new concept. Remember the first time you think that a mouse on the computer eat cheeze? Same thing with apt-get. Just takes time to learn and understand.
    Furthermore, Linux was not made for the home user. Linux is a kernel. There are different implementation of the same kernel e.g SuSe, RedHat. SOme are made friendly like Linspire or Ubuntu and Suse. Others are made with a target audience in mine such as Debian etc.

    Linux is a viable option Victory Napitupulu -- 06/02/06

    Businesses considering porting over to Windows Vista may not be making a wise decision. First of all the system requirements are just far too expensive, if Windows XP can do the job sufficiently then there would be no reason to fork out such a large sum of money in order to obtain new licences and upgrade all the PCs.

    New security features? Bugfixes? Third-party companies such as Symantec and McAfee will always be developing and releasing security suites which will by far exceed the capabilities offered to us by the Microsoft developers. It would be smarter to just use these applications to further secure a Windows system than to purchase a 'completely new network'.

    If the upcoming distributions of Linux are released and are somewhat comparable to the power of Windows Vista then certainly opting for Linux would be a far more economical decision. Most offices/business rely on UNIX or Linux based servers and running the desktop distributions may even boost system functionality. Furthermore the typical business generally only runs office applications such as word processors, such as MS Office, which can easily be substituted for a free linux alternative such as OpenOffice.

    Nowadays the transition from say Windows XP SP2 to Linux distributions such as Ubuntu is not too difficult to make. You'd need to be a high-end gamer to be unable to make this switch.

    I have even made the decision to opt for running the Ubuntu distribution of Linux rather than Windows Vista on the laptop which I am purchasing as I enter university. Internet browsing, email, instant messaging, office applications, music, videos, etc etc all of this can be done on a Linux desktop. So why fork out for something so expensive when a free alternative is available and allows you to carry out the same activities?

    Precisely! Anonymous -- 06/02/06 (in reply to #120128659)

    "Nowadays the transition from say Windows XP SP2 to Linux distributions such as Ubuntu is not too difficult to make. You'd need to be a high-end gamer to be unable to make this switch. "

    You hit the nail right on the head. If I wasn't a huge gamer, I would be switching everything over to Linux. However, Ubuntu is sort of a 'demo' version of Linux. It is certainly the bridging point (in my opinion) between Windows XP and Linux. I would like to see more game developers supporting development on linux before I made the full switch. I know cedega exists - but it's still not 100%.

    Not quite.. Victory Napitupulu -- 06/02/06 (in reply to #120128660)

    Exactly. However for a business or for study-only purposes Linux is a powerful alternative. Therefore most businesses and educational institutes should be able to make the move over to Linux and save a fortune.

    Unfortunately native gaming isn't quite up to par on Linux. However with the recent news of VMWare becoming released for free I think that by creating a Windows installation using VMWare inside of a Linux distribution gaming should be possible. I'm not sure about the performance of a game running on a virtualised operating system environment but I'm assuming for now that performance is the same compared to a native operating system installation.

    In the end we'll have to see how much fireworks are packed into Vista and whether or not we need it. Besides, its highly likely that most XPSP2-compatible applications won't be Vista-compatible. If thats the case then Linux with VMWare sounds like a good option for me.

    Gaming in VMWare Anonymous -- 07/02/06 (in reply to #120128662)

    Unfortunately VMWare doesn't work with 3D well. Cedega is the closest we have (apart from ID software, and the people behind Unreal).

    Still agree that it could happen. But I would think alot of corporations won't actually bother with the upgrade at all. Windows XP and Office 2003 seem to be functioning rather fine in many organisations. There isn't really a need to switch (apart from obvious security concerns which keep the System Administrators with a high paid job ;))

    Virtualisation! Rex Alfie Lee -- 15/02/06 (in reply to #120128662)

    Virtualisation as a gamer I'm pretty sure, would slow the speed of the game to a major degree. I think most gamers would find it unbearable.

    Basically, virtualisation adds another layer between the hardware & the interrupts & this extra layer is a layer within another operating system. Without a huge hardware speed update I reckon the drop in speed is going to be unviable for gamers.

    BTW, I am not a gamer myself & I prefer Linux to Microsux.

    A new Vista on Linux Marilyn Weate -- 08/02/06

    Linux is more compatible with other software than Windows. Winetools make using wine to run Windows apps a breeze. How many Linux programs can you run under Windows? Why should Windows and their dictatorial attitude of 'this only works with Windows' be seen as the only view.Some of us oldies remember writing our own software before Gates.Via patenting Gates wants to create a world where his is the ONLY software.

    Hardware wise I have had some hellish problems getting drivers for some versions of Windows. SuSE and Debian usually find and install your hardware during setup [which is also quite painless] without any even minor glitchs.

    SuSE Rex Alfie Lee -- 15/02/06 (in reply to #120128805)

    Like you I really like SuSE. Haven't tried Debian but have used SuSE since Caldera threw themselves into the firing line & became SCO.

    Mostly the hardware is installed on setup but it would be nice to have a GUI that would allow installation of hardware after the fact, in particular hardware that takes some work to install; eg downloading software automatically & installing it as well, or knowing where the software can be found that is required or if it can't be installed it knows that too & lets you know.

    Linux Hardware Installs Rex Alfie Lee -- 10/02/06

    An area that does annoy me with Linux is the inability to use a hardware install screen to determine what the hardware is.

    Rather than having the operating system determine this on initial build of the operating system, it would be nice to have a hardward determining GUI as does Windows, one thathas information regarding the type of software required & perhaps an auto-connect base that knows whether or not the hardware can be installed or not.

    Yes. Anonymous -- 13/02/06 (in reply to #120128980)

    Windows has an adequate service for providing details of what hardware is. Most manufacturers also include a Driver CD. As the Windows OS is only one CD, and an entire OS update isn't released every 6 months, you are going to have to expect some major updates. Maybe you should stick to Linux and never use Windows again if you struggle to use to OS.

    So what was your point? Rex Alfie Lee -- 15/02/06 (in reply to #120129184)

    Did you actually have something to say or did you respond because you have a small peeniss?

    Was the problem my articulation? Was it that you actually didn't understand what was written? Perhaps you might need your Mum to decrypt the message for you. That way at least your comments may eventually mean something.

    Oh & BTW, your Anony-mouse respondant name shows another problem with your communication skills. Cowardice!

    Just reread Anonymous -- 16/02/06 (in reply to #120129231)

    Sorry, I just reread it. I misread it thinking that you were stating that Linux had a better hardware system than Windows. My Mistake.

    Apology Rex Alfie Lee -- 24/02/06 (in reply to #120129314)

    I also apologise for my rudeness! I must admit I didn't really understand what your point was. Thank you for being honest & I again apologise. Sometimes I can get just a little tense.

    Fedora kudzu does this job well Zaw -- 16/02/06 (in reply to #120128980)

    I think kudzu does this job relatively well. One thing I want to see is that loading the manufacturer binary driver at instllation time. I once did it on XP installation when SATA first appeared on the motherboard. I think press F6 and load the binary driver.

    I have read in a forum that FreeBSD can do that.

    the distro is here Anonymous -- 22/02/06

    look at gentoo linux (gentoo.org), it surpasses windows in every way i can think of. i personally use both linux and windows on a daily basis. gentoo linux has inherent advantages windows can never have. when you install it its opptimize specifically for your system, everything is compiled from source code just for you. the result is a blazing fast os. however thats not even the best part, after its installed to install something all you have to do is type emerge firefox, for instance and firefox source code is downloaded then it automatically compiles opptimised to the max. its not even that easy in windows. why do i still use windows? linux's one short comeing compatibility with windows software. when the day comes that my favorite computer games get released for linux ill drop windows in a heartbeat.

    Exactly what everyone else is waiting for Craigos -- 26/02/06 (in reply to #120129650)

    As soon as software is made for linux (ie Adobe, Macromedia etc...) and not just emulation layers (ie Crossover, Wine, Cedega etc...) - I think most people will switch.

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