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Breaking News: Reports of NSW MP internet misuse 'flawed'
ZDNet / Government / Story
Govt wants ISPs to record browsing history
Topics
interception, government, attorney-general, snooping, electronic frontiers australia, internet industry association, iia, efa, online, security, browser, history, isp, browsing
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keanzu June 12th, 2010
stindal June 11th, 2010
Companies who provide customers with a connection to the internet may soon have to retain subscriber's private web browsing history for law enforcement to examine when requested, a move which has been widely criticised by industry insiders.
(Camera video de surveillance
image by Frédéric Bisson, CC2.0)
The Attorney-General's Department yesterday confirmed to ZDNet Australia that it had been in discussions with industry on implementing a data retention regime in Australia. Such a regime would require companies providing internet access to log and retain customer's private web browsing history for a certain period of time for law enforcement to access when needed, according to Australian internet service provider sources.
Currently, companies that provide customers with a connection to the internet don't retain or log subscriber's private web browsing history unless they are given an interception warrant by law enforcement, usually approved by a judge. It is only then that companies can legally begin tapping a customer's internet connection.
In March 2006, the European Union formally adopted its data retention directive (PDF), a directive which the Australian Government said it wished to use as an example if it implemented such a regime.
"The Attorney-General's Department has been looking at the European Directive on Data Retention, to consider whether such a regime is appropriate within Australia's law enforcement and security context," a statement from the Attorney-General's Department to ZDNet Australia said yesterday. "It has consulted broadly with the telecommunications industry."
The EU regime requires that the communications providers from certain EU member states retain necessary data as specified in the Directive for a period of between six and 24 months.
One internet service provider (ISP) source told ZDNet Australia that the Australian regime, if implemented, could go as far as recording each URL a customer visited and all emails.
That source said such a regime "would be scary and very expensive".
Another industry source said Australians should "be very f***ing afraid".
They said the regime being considered by the Australian Government could see data held for much longer than EU Directive time of 24 months — it would be more like five or ten years.
"They seem quite intent [on implementing the regime] and they keep throwing up the words 'terrorism' and 'paedophiles'," the source said. "We're talking browsing history and emails, way beyond what I would consider to be normal SMS, retaining full browsing history and everything."
The office of the Attorney General has since denied that the data retention regime would involve recording users' web browsing history.
Internet Industry Association (IIA) chief executive officer (CEO) Peter Coroneos also confirmed that the industry was having discussions with the Attorney-General's Department.
"There has been some preliminary discussions with the Attorney-General's Department about a proposal for a data retention regime in Australia, but I think those discussions are at a very early stage," Coroneos said. He said the IIA hadn't "seen any firm proposals yet from the government".
"It's more along the lines of [the Attorney-General's Department asking] 'What do you see the issues of being if we were to move to a position similar to the EU'," he said.
"But as I say, there wouldn't be any intention, I wouldn't think, to move to any policy position on this unless there was a full public debate about the proposal."
If the idea were to move to a more "serious proposal", Coroneos said the IIA's view would be "to engage not only with the industry but also the community in a proper discussion".
Electronic Frontier Australia (EFA) chair Colin Jacobs said the regime was "a step too far".
"At some point data retention laws can be reasonable, but highly-personal information such as browsing history is a step too far," Jacobs said. "You can't treat everybody like a criminal. That would be like tapping people's phones before they are suspected of doing any crime."
He added that browser history could reveal all sorts of personal information. "And furthermore, the way the internet works, it's a huge amount of data to be kept and it requires some snooping on the part of the ISPs into which [web] pages people are looking at."
In February, the senate passed a Bill allowing ISPs to intercept traffic as part of "network protection activities". According to an ISP source, it's likely another Bill would be required for a data retention regime to be implemented.
"It is likely that new legislation will be required to put any [data retention] obligations in place," the source said. "It seems to be early days yet, and we have an election looming, which means there will be some time required to get any new law in place."
Update at 1:00pm, 14 May 2010: Added "according to Australian internet service provider sources" to the second paragraph to clarify that Australian ISP sources claimed that this is what the Australian version of the Directive could look like. A link to a story with further comment from the Attorney General was also added.
Talkback
Hmmm, is it too cynical to assume that any "full public debate about the proposal" will take place AFTER the election? If the coalition will come out clearly against this and the filter, they'd have my vote, but somehow I can't see that happening either :-(
malcolmgroves June 11th, 2010I'm assuming the use of a simple proxy server will avoid this government mandated privacy breach as well?
Of course this is different from Google, who threw away encrypted data. It's likely that the government will be recording any encrypted data as well as clear text sent via your browser.
This reeks of Steven Conroy. Scary, scary stuff.
Pachanga June 11th, 2010Great idea!
Even better - and more fitting in an up and coming totalitarian society such as Oz, would be if all police, senior public servants and politicians of all levels were required to wear a voice recorder 24 X 7. Each day, the recordings would be scanned by voice recognition software looking for suspicious references to bribe taking, murder, branch stacking, paedophilia & terrorism.
Dont worry though, no honest official would have anything to fear from this. All paid for by those wearing the recorders of course!
Grumpy9999 June 11th, 2010Grumpy9999, that is an excellent idea! I wish I had have thought of it.
Also, I think they should concern themselves with getting the broadband service up to standard before they worry about policing it and wasting tax money on such a ridiculous scheme!
The Joe June 11th, 2010MMM
not to sure if the proxy will protect on this one. If they search for URL's, they could probably pick it up in the content
We assume this would go hand-in-hand with the Filter
pilotyoda June 13th, 2010That is a very grave and concerning proposal. I do not support unilateral surveillance of Australian citizens without cause and a warrant.
I believe that Colin's analogy to surveilling all users of the telephone network is very apt. I do not think that a government would suggest that as there would be an uprising. The only difference is far more information can be captured from Internet use.
I am horrified and I was equally horrified at the EU directive at the time.
Roo June 11th, 2010Actually, I think you'll be disappointed if you expect an uprising. We thought the Australian people would be outraged when the filter idea was brought out. Instead, they whined a little bit, a few people made some angry placards and then we all forgot about it.
I think we're a bit too laid back for our own good.
Rubella June 18th, 2010gimme a break... obviously everything has been recorded since day one, now they're just looking for a legitimate reason to use what they've already collected. news stories are lessons in history nowadays. gimme a dang break already. jeez.
springwick June 11th, 2010Springwick, as someone who works in an ISP-like organization, I assure you, this information is not recorded in any way, shape or form by anyone - it costs too much money to do so.
This, if it actually become a bill, would be an unacceptable invasion of my online privacy - for shame, Labour
reaps June 11th, 2010Hey Bro, do you work in a ISP or ISP like company ? Big difference. lol & any server that provides such a connection - doesnt it know where its routing its services ? or does **** just connect and make connections to servers by magic? What i reckon is that this type of recording is similure to auditing in a company. They are only now making each connection/session from a client using their Service - entered into a log. for so called autiding kind of purposes - still sucks, lol
zerokewl June 11th, 2010it would be illegal for them to use anything prior to this new law, as it wasnt implemented and cannot be legally recorded in past tense
zerokewl June 11th, 2010Springwick, I agree with reaps but would add, I work as a backup administrator for a large content provider & run daily, weekly (incr), monthly (diff), quaterly (full) & yearly (full) backups of online billing data. By law we are required to keep transaction details for 7 yrs. The company I work for covers 38% of the market in Australia/NZ and we are one of 7 companies in the field. Our monthly differential backup averages 26TB & last years full 183TB of compressed data with other companies setup for the sole purpose of storing the backup tapes. The cost of these legal requirements have increased the cost of content provision by 15% just to cover media storage, pickups & returns. The scope, scale & cost of what will be required to maintain a 5 - 10 year retention of all browser history & emails is frightening & the costs will be passed onto consumers.
billcruncher June 12th, 2010very sad proposal, i dont think they have anymore idea to gain support from voters, this way too much breaching peoples privacy. may as well we all live under one roof so that we can see what undies youre wearing?
nexusys June 11th, 2010If anything, this will actually make things WORSE. If this were implemented, the criminals would be using encrypted connections to proxies outside of the country as a matter of course, and the police will have no chance of ever tapping into anything useful. You'd have terabytes of recorded data on every person in the country... EXCEPT the criminals!
Dean Harding June 11th, 2010OMG... when will this pathetic excuse of a government, and especially that moronic imbecile Stephen Conroy, understand that our privacy does not belong to them. It makes their vehemence at Google a little bit more understandable if in "Conroy World" he thinks that Google was stealing our privacy from them. Internet filter, Data retention, the new customs directives... soon it will be CCTV in our homes recording everything we do for THAT is virtually exactly what this is
chris21 June 11th, 2010Here's a hint for senator no clue. No educated criminal sits there browsing away without some sort of encryption going on. They will encrypt their traffic with 1024bit encryption and you will have no idea what they are doing. All you will be doing is breaching the privacy of innocent people. Get a clue.
TheGreesh June 11th, 2010Next Rudd & Conroy will require Australia Post to photo copy all letters, akin to E-MAIL, and store then on micro film.
We elected this bunch, so have endure their follies.
Vasso Massonic June 11th, 2010"We elected this bunch, so have endure their follies."
What do you mean "we?"
Harold of Bunbury June 11th, 2010"we" is the clear majority of Australians who voted for them. Compared to the other option at the time (and now still), it seemed like a good idea at the time. :-/
techydude June 11th, 2010politicians and public servants should be forced to wear yellow armbands.
gikku June 11th, 2010Harold, it's a figure of speech. I did not vote them in.
Here's an interesting addendum.............
Tassies, don't seem to trust this lot !
"Yet, at the moment, Tasmania has the lowest proportion of households with a broadband internet connection in Australia. Less than half of Tasmanians have access to broadband in their homes. That's compared with almost two thirds on the mainland, and almost three-quarters in the nation's capital." Courtesy:
http://www.zdnet.com.au/rudd-tells-tasmanians-why-they-need-nbn-339303803.htm
Vasso Massonic June 11th, 2010The Australian people are basically sheep, so this will probably happen. But how about making the information of every Government employee, including all politicians, or anybody who works for a company that does business with the Government, have their internet details posted on the Internet, along with all of their emails? After all, they are the people who are watching, so they should be watched to make sure they are the kind of people we all want to be watched by.
Richardhg June 11th, 2010You're assuming that every public servant, at every level of Government supports this proposal. I'm a public servant (state level) and I've gone on the record since Day 0 that the measures Conroy and Rudd's 'kitchen cabinet' have employed are disgusting, abhorrent, and not in tune with Australia's values, principals and needs as a society.
The fact is that a majority of Australians (thankfully not the majority of Western Australians, myself included, who knew the devious & deceitful people they were and had the good sense to hand Labour their arse on a platter at the last federal election) voted for the current Government.
It's important that these same Australians stand up to these elected representatives and tell them what they're doing is not what they voted for - and consequently vote them out at the next election. I'm sure they don't want their nation to be compared to the likes of China, Iran, North Korea, and other oppressive regimes who trample of the rights of good citizens to do their thing online unimpeded & with the presumption of innocence.
Say what you want about the previous Howard Government, but at least for the most part they left the internet alone and like good capitalists and social conservatives allowed it to sort itself out.
thewinchester June 11th, 2010Sounds like they might have finally twigged that the filter is a no-go and that this is the next best thing - retroactively punishing people for their internet "crimes".
If this comes to pass I pledge to taking to the streets and causing maximum civil disruption.
GusGrogan June 11th, 2010With net censorship, browsing history, electricity's smart meters monitoring property (and possibly item) usage, police with numberplate recognition cameras, surveillance cameras mounted in all public places with I presume, soon to be installed facial recognition software where has privacy gone? 1984 took a while to get here but it certainly has arrived. Look forward to the barcode on the back of the head and the microchip under the skin.
bigal12 June 11th, 2010Mm, the NWO might be coming sooner than we think.
Rubella June 18th, 2010It was not OK for Google to collect private information, but Rudd/ConnedRoy want private ISP's to do the same?? Where's the double standards here??
churchey June 11th, 2010Ok, please stop. Do you really believe the government needs to make requests through the judicial process to do what they do? If you are that naive, then maybe you don't need a computer anyway. Our Constitution has been overhauled more than Joan Rivers face and if you really think you will make a difference in complaining, well type a few unsavory anti government words in your computer and see who knocks on your door. I learned some time ago that you don’t go against the system, you only get burned. Trust me, live life without worry; you don’t want to know what they really do. Data storage is nothing new; they have always had access, let it go. PS, Again, Big brother is always watching, so just live free and stop worrying.
companyman June 11th, 2010It's just like east Germany before the wall came down, except in Australia there is no wall to climb to get out.
timminscorp June 11th, 2010Who was the journalist that said on national ABC television recently when discussing the Internet that "these people masturbate while watching child porn". What hope do Australians have of maintaining their basic freedoms with zealot imbeciles like him on the loose????
sydneyla June 11th, 2010Companyman, the Constitution has hardly ever been changed, and that is the preference of government despite your view on government doing what it likes. At the very least it hasn't be amended for 30+ years, and has seen scant change since it was first introduced.
theknowledge June 11th, 2010Companyman, the Constitution has hardly ever been changed, and that is the preference of government despite your view on government doing what it likes. At the very least it hasn't be amended for 30+ years, and has seen scant change since it was first introduced.
theknowledge June 11th, 2010OK, if that's how the "government" wants to play... We will simply respond with daily Freedom of Information requests demanding access to all email, web browsing records and communications on government computers from any Minister who supports (or fails to stand up against) this terrible fascist-like action.
I work for a government department, and all email and web browsing is logged. Fair enough; they are systems that the taxpayers have bought. The way these systems are used have to be able to withstand public scrutiny because any member of the public can request the logs. So, people, get your FOI requests ready if this terrible, terrible idea comes to pass.
F.O.I. June 11th, 2010This this that same Attorney General who recently attacked Google for not respecting peoples privacy.
DanBuzzard June 11th, 2010I am very worried.
What interests are encouraging the government to implement these policies.
foobyers June 11th, 2010Newsflash for the government. Anyone who is a criminal will simply use anonymisation software, which can't be logged.
Our government needs to do a computing 101 course, because it's clear they DONT understand enough to make policies about the internet. Even high school children regularly use proxies these days, but they either think people are clueless, or are damned clueless themselves
Furthermore, website logging doesn't differentiate between an illegal popup which they closed instantly, and someone who opened the same site and oogled it.
I think it's really time to start a new political party with fresh politicians, because at least they know how to use a computer.
auz June 11th, 2010Yes aus, it is time for a new political party, because the choices we have at the moment leave a lot to be desired.
DGE June 14th, 2010After hearing this announcement, I am seriously considering purchasing stock in an offshore web proxy... Its a really strange feeling, I'm an adult who has never had so much as a speeding ticket and my government is making me paranoid about downloading diggnation, just in case they show me a preview of a game that is unsuitable for classification in Australia because some vampire slayer shows some side boob.
I wonder how many Sex offenders the police could investigate (with the existing privacy laws we have here) with all the money the Mr Conroy has spent on not protecting children from the internet?
dshears June 11th, 2010@foobyers - their interests are to the NWO and their one-world government. They need the controls in place to pull it off, and the Internet is their biggest threat to awake the masses to their scam.
PoliceStateMuch June 11th, 2010I don't know why they're looking on the intarnets for peedyfiles, all our peedyfiles are on television.
http://www.theage.com.au/entertainment/tv-and-radio/abc-host-faces-child-pornography-charge-20100611-y2p2.html
http://www.theage.com.au/national/hey-dad-star-hughes-denies-sex-abuse-claims-20100324-qwrh.html
alex4point0 June 11th, 2010why doesnt the government just hire someone to follow us around 24/7. I thought australia was a democratic society but it looks like were becoming slowly very communist, with rules and laws on everything these days. If this does go through the public will have to stand up and fight the government for out basic human right of privacy.
xpansion09 June 11th, 2010Yep, that's what we'll do "F.O.I.". Write them a 'Stern Letter' Gimme a break!
So, does ANYONE actually believe ANY of this is going to end well?
At the risk of sounding like a crazy Christian type, there's a well known religious book that says this sorta crap is a mere introduction to the impending shitstorm about to hit us.
I sure hope I have MY house in order when it all hits the fan.
Pedro33 June 11th, 2010pathetic. absolutely pathetic.
whats going to happen next? porn being illegal? again?
we are NOT European, we aren't driven so hard by the rest of the worlds troubles. I cant understand why our governments officials have to be pricks to make themselves feel good. If they wanted to copy someone overseas why cant they give us ADSL +3? it would actually benefit us and push us forward not backwards!
shadowkie June 11th, 2010Because people were stupid enough to vote conservative. Don't look at me, I was only 14 at the last election!
Hyperion June 16th, 2010One less vote from me this election! DEFINITELY!
JoelMcColl June 11th, 2010This government needs a bit of a V for Vendetta-like response. What the hell is this country coming to? Post 9/11, our freedoms and privacy are being crushed in an ever-tightening grip.
avoidz June 12th, 2010We need to take a different approach Australia this has to stop.
Another industry source said Australians should "be very f***ing ANGRY".
There, corrected that for us.
AngryPlatypus June 12th, 2010I'm Just a dumb American.
My only experience with Australians is a couple of drinking buddies liasing with the British government in Germany in the late '70s and a young lady I met at the Heineken Brewery in Amsterdam.
However, based on my (very limited) sampling, every Australian I know would have gently, and with the greatest patience, told the purveyors of this governmental rectal probe to **** up a rope.
badgergizmo June 12th, 2010I once use to fear extraterrestrial life. Now I hope they come and remove all governments from control and let the people have the ability to make their own decisions as they once did a long time ago without greedy controlling leaders. And who said Hitler was evil when we have our wonderful leaders of today !!! Pathetic. Now when is this contact gonna happen again?
Saxx71 June 12th, 2010The two major parties need a wake up call. Vote Independents, Greens and direct your preferences. Then if all else fails...
1. Network, Proxy Settings, SOCKS -> localhost:1080
2. “ssh -D 1080 user@any.random.server.running.sshd.in.nontotalitarian.country”
3. Protect what’s yours under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights:
Article 12. “No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.”
Article 19. “Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.”
Bye bye Mr Conroy… and screw your fascist NWO, WAR IS PEACE, FREEDOM IS SLAVERY, and IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH…
Don’t think it’ll make you anonymous though… If you want to be really scared about tracking and abuse of your privacy see http://panopticlick.eff.org/
Various implementations of ssh exist (below is for OpenSSH). If you want to run on Windows, you can configure PuttySSH to do this also. (optional: Install FoxyProxy if you want selective use of the proxy based on URL patterns)
“man ssh”
-D
Specifies a local “dynamic” application-level port forwarding.
This works by allocating a socket to listen to port on the local
side, optionally bound to the specified bind_address. Whenever a
connection is made to this port, the connection is forwarded over
the secure channel, and the application protocol is then used to
determine where to connect to from the remote machine. Currently
the SOCKS4 and SOCKS5 protocols are supported, and ssh will act
as a SOCKS server. [...]
While you're at it, if you want to be really scared about tracking and abuse of your privacy see http://panopticlick.eff.org/
Then consider using an independent browser like Firefox, install Ghostery, TrackMeNot and NoScript.
david1984 June 12th, 2010If Australia has so many paedophiles and terrorists that this kind of scheme is warranted then I'd suggest that other countries would want to consider refusing us visas. If such a high percentage of Australians are criminals then why let them into your country?
keanzu June 12th, 2010Isn't this something to go to war about? Freedom! Freedom of speech and freedom to go about one's business without being treated as having criminal intent? There is NO doubt that anyone who had views in opposition with any government in power would have this type of data scrutinised and recorded without their knowledge. Think about what happened during the Watergate affair during the Nixon rein in the USA. This is Watergate Plus – legalised. If all this information was recorded (including emails, then I assume web chats either typed or voice audio like skype) how could anyone think that this was not a violation of privacy? The Minister or persons who are looking at implementing this or suggesting this must have a hellish unsound mind and are a real menace to our society. They need to be seriously looked upon as having some sort of personality disorder. As the Prime Minister obviously has knowledge about this, this is tarnishing him too!
WaterGate June 12th, 2010Really who cares what these idiots do? They have the impression they can prevent freedom of information via the Internet, under the guise of protecting us - they simply can't. All of it can be bypassed, all of it can be circumvented all of this can be done anonymously. They simply push things further away from their control and make themselves a target of those that will no go quietly into the night. I for one will educate everyone I know (beginning with my children) about their basic human right - freedom. I didn't bring them into this world to become slaves, I will not tolerate authoritarianism. Whilst other countries genuinely have to fight for something resembling freedom, our administration continues to fritter away the potential we have (had).
Makes me think of Serenity, Mr Universe: "You can't stop the signal, Mal. Everything goes somewhere, and I go everywhere".
The question is: who of you out there in citizen-land are willing to risk your lifestyle to fight (non-violent reference) for what you believe in?
Havelclown June 12th, 2010The biggest idiot makes the loudest noise and its so entertaining.
Everyone expresses indignation.
VPN. Onion Routing. Should we have to? No.
Who is going to stop the biggest idiot from spending all that money?
3and20 June 12th, 2010Wait a minute ... why do they need to track peoples browsing history if they have an internet filter in place? Shouldn't the filter be stopping people from going to any of the "perceived" illicit sites? If the filter is going to work they don't need this. I get the feeling that this is a ploy designed to fail but to also take focus away from the filter debate. Everyone will get their panties in a twist over this one and the filter ends up looking like the lesser of the two evils and so gets passed.
mattyman June 12th, 2010How many million to get how many incarcerations?
How many police could these millions afford?
How many billions are we in debt?
Why is the Government wasting money on this stuff?? I DONT GET IT
thecapz June 12th, 2010So typical of these wannabe tyrants.
I know something about the "Australian Government" that goes to the heart of any claims it has to legitimacy to do something like this, or anything at all, come to think of it. The "dirt" I have will only work if enough people make enough of a fuss about it, but here it is:
There is no "Australian Government". The Constitution stipulates only Commonwealth and State governments and nothing else. If they're only the Commonwealth Government, why are they bothering to call themselves something else, and if they are claiming their authority from some other source, what is it and who are they?What is the legal nature of the entity known as the "Australian Government"?Why has every recent Prime Minister styled himself as the head of the "Australian Government"? Do they know something we don't know? Are they faking it to make it?
These creeps will be stopped if we question their authority loudly and persistently enough.
BugBear June 14th, 2010@reaps If you don't believe that there is already a system watching every single bit running around this fair country, you are naive.
This is just a ploy to (a) bring what they are already doing out into the open and (b) push the cost out of the super-secret budgets and onto the monthly cost of being connected. Follow the money in these times of tight budgets.
Dangerous stuff here. The ISPs cannot possibly be relied upon to maintain the systems needed to keep the data truly un-hackable. Give me a break. Even banks and government sites get hacked.
Next thing, they will ban access to proxies because only evil people will use them. Then will come the need to "register" your SSL-encrypted VPN to your overseas employer and then we'll be just like China, banning free speech in order to corral and brainwash the masses into a single narrow point of view.
blagh.
ozdma June 14th, 2010I would like to peacefully and respectfully point out that the combined numbers of public servants and politicians in Australia is really quite a tiny number in comparison to the entire Australian population. By my reckoning we outnumber them by somewhere in excess of 21 million. Should there be an uprising in this country by the people against the innumerable invasions of our privacy and the destruction of our inalienable property rights by Governments, I can confidently predict that no such Government will stand once the good will of the people is lost and they are forced into action. I fear that the clock of revolution is ticking ever louder with every additional imbecilic scheme that they impose upon us. In my opinion, it will not be long before we start to see mass disobedience and non-compliance of all sorts of laws and regulations by the people once they get pushed too far. Already, over 200,000 people are apparently refusing to register motor vehicles in New South Wales alone, while thousands of others are reufusing to pay all sorts of traffic fines, land rates, taxes, and other penalties because they now regard Government as the enemy of the people. If I were the Government I would be very worried indeed, and doing my utmost to RESTORE the rights and freedoms of Australians before they are taken back by the people, without any notice and at every opportunity. Back-off from the Internet you idiots before you end up pulling your own plugs.
Richard Wells
Richard Wells June 14th, 2010maybe, we should complain to Human Rights organisation...
check out what's happening in Belarus (and it's 3rd world country) - http://humanrightshouse.org/Articles/14365.html
same this is starting to happen Aus!
In Belarus the law says "an internet browser who wants to stay anonymous in the web is breaking the law and can be punished severely". Bye bye VPN!
Australia is not far off!!!!
JaMal007 June 15th, 2010What a joke. Labor really are all about big government and big brother. I think those who are already outraged about the big filter need to know about this new big brother move by Rudd and co.
Joel1 June 15th, 2010Someone needs to toss those **** conservatives out of the government. If I'm forced to vote, I'm voting Greens/Independent/whatever.
Hyperion June 16th, 2010I'd like to point out that there is a treaty between the US, UK, NZ, AUS, that allows the filtering/pilfering/ of all forms of electronic communications in the interests of "National Security" the Echelon System that is run by the NSA, CIA, MI5, MI6, Signals Directorate already listens to your phone calls, reads your emails (encrypted or not either way it can be broken) nothing is perfect, nothing is uncrackable/unhackable given enough time, processing power and resources anything can be accomplished most internet security products have a built in backdoor for law enforcement purposes so that the AFP, FBI, etc, can use their carnivore like programs to enter into a suspects machine without any flags being raised by the security software.
So call me a "conspiracy theory nut job" but its true do some research before that gets blocked too by mr conjob.
I'd like to know if there is a way to force this numbskull out of office lets show a vote of no confidence in mr conjob
Jegar June 17th, 2010Just wanted to bring attention to WebSpy’s latest blog: Government sanctioned ISP Filtering & Monitoring – Is Australia going Orweillian? at http://www.webspy.com.au/blogs/index.php/government-sanctioned-isp-filtering-and-monitoring/
WebSpy provides reporting software for organizations and highlights how the proposed regime is different and why there’s need for concern.
Asa Davidsson June 17th, 2010I find it hilarious that people blaming the gov, when they are just following the trend.
In Europe, a number of country's have done this or worse, there is very few countries in EURO zone that doesn't have some kind of policy like this.
ZeroNut June 22nd, 2010The question we need to ask and have answered is who are the faceless people who are putting such suggestions forward to the Minister? There is no way he would have the time to research and come up with these ideas himself, so someone; dept of comms, security organisation, personal support team, religious organisation, party colleagues, business group - must be putting ideas of this nature AND a policy brief before him, AND this must have support from those around him whom he trusts. Otherwise it would not see the light of day and be dismissed as crazy nonsense. So by elimination we can look at:
Business Organisations? Highly unlikely. No net benefit and they are as suspicious of government probing and data collection as anyone. Also, no peak body (IPA, BCA) that could act in this way without leaking. No consensus within groups. Just not that organised.
Security services? Unlikely. They already have the powers and means to do surveillance of anyone they need to and would not want any light shone on there activities. They already spy on ministers. Look at the 1st Defence minister under Rudd, Joel Fitzgibbon. Who gained access to his e-mail and bank records to show he had an apparently un-healthy relationship with the Chinese business woman? (interesting that the press did not pursue this after the first day of scandal) Spooks like to keep a low profile.
Dept of Comms? Possible. Under Howard et al the culture of many PS depts was changed with selective hiring at top levels and defensive attitudes to FOI and public access to internal discussions. We saw that in the Immigration Dept. under Ruddock. Xenophobia to the degree that we later discovered 278 cases of illegal detention by the Dept and the shipping of Australian Citizens overseas to be dumped in the Philippines, (Vivian Alvarez) and the ombudsman's report which damned the culture in the Dept. Couple this with the "Canberra Effect" where the entire city is largely Public Service, Government Apparatchiks & Service Providers and there is little or no connection with the rest of the country, and it is possible that a culture of control, and a need to defend the "Government" against the ability of the internet make available information widely and uncontrollably (Wikileaks Black list) could gain credence among those providing advice. Conroy's hysterical reaction to the Wikileaks event could provide a clue. To say that the PS is clear of such people is to forget fake e-mail, Malcolm Turnbull and "The Mole" Godwin Grech...(and who could forget Godwin Grech??!!). So it is not in the realm of conspiracy theory that these sorts of policies might originate in the labyrinthine machinations of the PS. It would not be the first time...
Party Colleagues? Highly unlikely. Too much diversity, too many strong opinions, some would be worried about what it would reveal about themselves etc -unless...
Religious Organisations, Personal advisors-support team, and A Powerful Cabinet Colleague. KRudd.
Conroy and Rudd are both fairly conservative Catholics and have both ventured into judgemental territory with regard to art and "morality" (Rudd with photographer Bill Henson, where his pavlovian response "disgusting" showed little knowledge of Henson's work, how it was regarded by our most prestigious galleries, critics, the public, other politicians, or the intent of the work...)(Conroy with his comments on internet content as he broadened the reach of a potential filter to include 'sites depicting drug use, crime, sex, cruelty, violence or "revolting and abhorrent phenomena" that "offend against the standards of morality".[Wikipedia]). The Catholic Church and in particular Cardinal Pell and the conservative Vic Archbishop Hart have taken a proactive role in exerting influence in the political sphere expressing their opinions about "morality", sexual preference, birth control and HIV, Islam, Climate Change, Immigration, Women's roles, IVF, Stem Cell research, RU486, and of course abortion rights. Oddly, the only topic in this realm they have been remarkably coy about is ridding the church of pedophiles, where they have actively set about protecting the church from scrutiny. Ironic, since pedophilia is what started the filter issue in the first place. Catholics have a loyalty factor to their church. It is ingrained from the earliest education, hard to discount if you continue to practice. Then there are the "advisors" whom we know little about. This would be an interesting area to research and might reveal a great deal about where these policy ideas originate and how they are "sold" to the minister. If they are a bunch of religious social conservatives from the right of Labor then we will have a clue. The rise of religious influence in politics began under Howard and appears to be continuing with Labor. The conservative retreat of the Catholic church in Oz and the rise of the Evangelical new mega churches (Hillsong, Catch the fire) with the inflow of American money and Media (ever watched late night TV on a Sunday morning??) has been seen as fertile ground for divide and conquer wedge politics and the famous "dog whistle" campaign statements. Tony Abbott is an expert at it.
(peaceful invasion fleet of refugees, child porn in every computer etc) which is difficult to counter. Hence the closing of the gap between Labor and the now very right wing Libs.
We can only hope that Gillard will snap out of the "small target campaign" mode, which clearly isn't working and take Abbot head on. That and continued pressure from the non-political advocacy groups, Get Up, Electronic Frontiers, the ISPs and the GP will show the Polies and campaign people that we are not fooled and we take our freedom of choice and freedom from government seriously. This is Australia. Nobody wants a nanny state.
(sorry, it turned into a bit of a rave.)
Comments? ....(references provided if requested)
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The hypocrisy of the Government is astounding. Right after they accuse Google of recording private information (which is being publicly broadcast mind you) they themselves now want to create "single greatest breach in the history of privacy."
Totally agreed with their hypocrisy on the issue.
As if we needed another reason to rid ourselves of Conroy/Mclelland and their posse - along one comes.
Sorry, but what the public does online is still subject to a presumption of innocence. If what they are doing is illegal, follow due process, establish the circumstances, and have independent judicial oversight determine if there's a legal reason to wiretap and record.
Otherwise - butt out. The current Government has messed around enough in technology - and its bad enough this filter will put is in the league of communist and totalitarian regimes.